At $700 you could build a pretty decent PC that would last a lot longer (3060 12gb, Ryzen 5 5600, 16gb of DDR4), and build a steam library that you’ll have 20 years from now. I’ve had the same monitor, keyboard and mouse for an easy 10; controllers don’t last that long. They’re reaching a point where there’s less and less of an actual argument for owning one.
build a steam library that you’ll have 20 years from now
How do you know that Steam will be around in 20 years?
Use GOG instead. The DRM-free game installers will outlive Steam :)
How do you know that Steam will be around in 20 years?
Use GOG instead, since the DRM-free game installers will outlive Steam :)
How do you know Windows will keep compatibility in 20 years? Valve money partially goes into Proton/WINE development and an evolution of that will absolutely be around in 20 years, just WINE was around 20 years ago already. CD Project doesn’t put any GOG/Cyberpunk money into breaking the Windows monopoly. (Also plenty of titles on Steam come without DRM because DRM is optional.)
My GOG games run great on wine, it just takes a bit more work to install them. Wine has better support for early windows games than windows does now.
CD Project doesn’t do anything to improve WINE, so spending money there is wasted.
How do you know Windows will keep compatibility in 20 years?
I didn’t mention Windows anywhere in my comment? GOG has Linux versions of games too, for games with Linux ports.
plenty of titles on Steam come without DRM because DRM is optional
That’s true - for the DRM-free Steam games, you can just keep a separate backup copy of the game files. They usually run fine without Steam installed.
Barely any game on GOG has a Linux port and CD Project enforces the Windows monopoly. GOG Galaxy only available for Windows, their own games only available for Windows, none of their massive resources put into improving WINE.
I was more successful running witcher 2 with the windows installer on the steam deck than with the linux one.
How many people actually download and store those installers though? I think GOG is awesome too but practically if you exclusively shop there you have the same problem unless you have a massive NAS on hand
How many people actually download and store those installers though?
… The hundreds of GOG-based torrents disagree with this sentiment. You don’t need EVERY person to store it. Just a handful of seedboxes can feed the world sort of thing…
Edit: But this does risk someone being malicious with the torrent of course…
I’ve still got my original installers and CD keys for Unreal Tournament 99 GOTY, Need for Speed Underground, Trackmania United, and a bunch of others, and even some DOS games, so there’s at least some of us that keep the installers. I have a few of them on USB hard drives I’ve collected over the last 25 years or so… I really need to move them onto my NAS. :)
I used to buy directly from the publisher though. Some of them still have working download links, for example Ubisoft/Nadeo still have a working download link for Trackmania United even though it’s nearly 20 years old now.
It’s kinda rich to plug Steam, where you also don’t own your games.
It comes pretty close to feature parity in terms of ownership. My kids can play my steam library on their own computers, I can play it on any machine I own, I don’t have to pay them any kind of rental fee, and they maintain my software for me.
Only thing I can’t do is what…sell my games to someone else? I don’t do that anyways.
I’m not betting on Steam disappearing in the next ten years. I probably wouldn’t even bet that they’ll disappear in my lifetime. But, they could, anything could happen, and then you don’t have that library anymore. Physical is the only way to truly own.
But, they could, anything could happen, and then you don’t have that library anymore. Physical is the only way to truly own.
That’s exactly my point. Steam has allowed me to OWN Half Life longer than I would have been able to with physical media. Those CDs don’t last that long. I’m not that careful.
So the balance is “own my own stuff and all the problems that come with keeping it pristine so that it continues to work, taking up space in my house” - or the infinitesimally small chance that STEAM goes belly up. Steam has allowed me to own my games for a lot longer than I could have kept them myself. So the argument of “oh they could go away!” doesn’t really hold any water for me. Especially for games with an online component (which is all of them now) – What’s the use of physical media when the game requires some servers that vanished long ago anyways?
That’s a strange point, imho. We disagree on what own means. You being bad with your physical media doesn’t mean you didn’t more truthfully own it. We will have to agree to disagree, have a nice day.
Well then you don’t own your home. With that argument, nobody does. Because the government has the ability to take your home from you, then you don’t own it.
Ownership has granularity to it. You’re failing to see the grey spaces in between, and only seeing black or white.
Well for Steam at least the library is independent of the hardware
Replace the 3060 with an equally-priced AMD card and you’ll actually get something decent for your money. Nvidia is horrible at these “lower” price points.
I mean, if you like horrible driver stability; sure. There’s a reason NVidia has like 75% of the market share, and it’s simply because they have a better product. Drivers are more stable, everyone develops for CUDA processing, lots of games only support DLSS for frame-gen, all of the GPU accelerated AI stuff is all NVidia centered, etc.
And something that can run PS3, PS2 and PS1 games!
I’m sorely disappointed that none of that fancy AI-powered Sony upscaling can be put to use to any of those old games.
I’ve had the same monitor, keyboard and mouse for an easy 10;
I guess it depends on frequency of use, but I’ve never had a mouse last ten years. I wear through the switch on the mouse button in less than that, starts to act unreliably.
Physical media or full rejection. Fuck you business school zombies squeezing blood from rocks
It was pretty much a given that this would happen, since there were already options with and without disc drives.
And obviously sooner or later gaming will probably move to an entirely online service like streaming.
It’s just a matter of time until the internet and worldwide coverage is ready for it. I always imagined that in a distant future we’d basically only buy a controller, that connects to an app that’ll let you stream. And every game will be in a subscription service like a Netflix.
Nah, they won’t do streaming cuz it’s too expensive.
Well, for now it is. Latency is also a big issue
No, it will always be more expensive to do streaming unless you run everything on crappy hardware
So I can’t play half the games I have, and the other half doesn’t need the extra console power. Yay. WOrtH iT.
I stopped buying consoles after they wanted to charge me to use the internet. That’s not how this works.
So, 24 years ago? If so, I’m right there with you in the “getting old” camp.
To be fair, you could play free on PS2. Although you had to buy a weird adapter.
Completely different strategy: the PS4 generation has produced a lot of games, sony could have stopped trying to compete with the high end PC market and gone in the Nintendo direction. Gives us new ways to access their library, give developers new tools to play with, release a 2nd mid-gen refresh and release a ps4 slim that is equivalent to the ps4 pro, encourage games for new ps4-slim and ps4 pro+. What do you think?
It’s too expensive. $500 is already too much for these things.
But capitalism’s gotta capitalism.
If you think $700 is bad, it’ll be £700 in the UK.
Which is $913.
Also:
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median household income, UK (2022): £32,400 ($42,265)
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median household income, USA (2022): $74,580
A PS5 Pro is 26% of the typical UK household monthly income.
A PS5 Pro is 11% of the typical US household monthly income.
The US pricing is bad. The UK pricing is absolutely insane.
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$700 is actually probably a fair price for a PS5. You can’t really build an equivalent PC for less than that. $900 to $1,200 would probably be close to how much manufacturing the PS5 Pro costs.
But PSN subsidizes these costs, which is why these systems can be this “affordable”.
900 to 1200’s an insane guess. This many years out R&D’s sure to have chilled out and companies that buy parts by the millions get them at much lower prices than individuals, plus partner companies that kit out their facilities to manufacture those parts recoup their investments in those facilities over time as well. I’m sure Sony’s still taking a few bucks hit on the sale of a console but it’s nowhere near close to double.
the fuck you are smoking? my first desktop kost that much and it ran crysis really fucking good
These days a good GPU costs almost $700 just by itself, mid range is almost $500, value is $400, budget is $250
The 4060 or the 7600xt are about in the ballpark for the original ps5, but you can’t beat the price if you don’t already have a computer with most of the components
Better than a PS5 Pro? Bruh 😂
Adjusted to inflation and time, hell yes
I doubt it costs that much. You’re looking at it from buying PC components perspective. But they are mass producing identical boards with components that are 4+ years old by now, except the GPU. The cost of production is probably around the same as it was for non-Pro when it was released.
I’m genuinely curious to how those things are going to sell. My knee jerk reaction is ‘oh hell no’ but there’s a lotta console players out there that want the power but just don’t want to get into PC gaming. Of course there seems to be a lot of people still playing on last gen consoles too so I have no idea where that’s going.
My PS4, PS3, PS2 are all working quite well.
The problem is the reason those people don’t get into PC gaming is because they don’t wanna spend $700 on a gaming machine.
That’s not necessarily true. I want my gaming to just work, and that’s not the case in Windows. It’s becoming less the case with console gaming, but I can still be confident that when I buy a game for my PlayStation it’ll actually boot, I won’t need to use third-party software for controller support, and I won’t need to tinker with drivers. That said, I already have a PS5. The TV I game on is still 1080p, so I don’t understand what $700 would get me over my current hardware.
Debt.
I can still be confident that when I buy a game for my PlayStation it’ll actually boot, I won’t need to use third-party software for controller support, and I won’t need to tinker with drivers.
Sounds like your last pc gaming experience was in the 90s.
I did have to install 3rd part drivers for Dualshock 3. And I will follow a GitHub guide when the gaming PC is upgraded to Win11 and Logitech f710 no longer works. https://gist.github.com/bsamadi/4d4070658b7ea4ee7960cae40a7fccb4
Well, you CAN actually use that 18 years old hardware with a PC. Try it on a PS5.
The other way around is actually supported
I don’t have a ps3 controller to try, but the internet seems to say no pretty unanimously.
Yeah, steam straight up tells you if games have support for controllers, and they are all plug-and-play…
Most people that I’ve spoken to don’t mention the price. They usually talk about how they just don’t know how to get games in the first place and start talking about settings and updates that they always hear about. That being said, I still don’t know like I said lol. I’m just curious and want to see how it goes.
I mean the same people bought PS5s at launch from scalpers.
I can say that for myself it’s not really just the price. I don’t have space to put a computer. With a console I can hook it to the TV and tuck it up under it. When I wanna play I can grab just the controller and sit on the couch. I like simplicity. With a pc I need a mouse, keyboard, desk, a chair, speakers, and a monitor. I know it can be hooked up to a tv however the tower still stands as an issue. The smaller compact towers that can be tucked have limited capabilities that rest below consoles.
On top of all that PCs are regularly getting releases years after a games release. PC gaming is only superior if the things going to be entirely utilized by the person and for some reason a lot of PC gamers think the average person will be doing so when that’s simply not the case.
Nah from what I’ve heard is because they perceive as being very complex, more so than it actually is.
Yup, not even slightly surprising, I do believe we have saw the last disk in a game console bit of a pity they are doing it in a refresh but you could tell from the bolted on disk drive that the only reason they added one at all is they would have lost alot of people who don’t have internet. The modern world will soon be completely inaccessible without internet.
How much space does it come out of the box? I bought my PS5 a year ago.
It came with 667GB of space. Some games take up 100gb.
And now you want to make it digital only??? Uhhhh, fuck that. You better be giving me like 1000 terabytes.
I agree with the sentiment, but the games don’t play off the disc. The discs contain the game data that is installed to the SSD. You’re using the same amount of storage whether you buy games physically or digitally. I buy mine physically because I like actually owning the game I paid $70 for.
You’re using the same amount of storage whether you buy games physically or digitally.
The difference being that you can load the content back onto the SSD at will, and regardless of server statuses… A lot of people have bandwidth caps or live in places with shit internet speeds.
Edit: I should clarify that I know some publishers only use the disc as a license of sorts with only a few MB of data… I’m wholly against this concept. Think publishers that don’t ship a working game on the disc should be barred from selling physical copies at all as it’s just landfill.
The pro upped the storage to 2TB, but I really feel like when the PS5 launched we were at the point where they should have shipped with 4TB drives.
I’m not going to defend the Pro exactly, but out of curiosity what is your usecase for needing so much storage on a console? Multiple users? Bad Internet? I feel like I have a max of 1-3 active games at a time, and can just delete and download/install them as needed. Works just fine for me so I feel like something else must be going on.
I have a 2TB SSD plugged into my 1TB Xbox. It’s all full. Average game size is 50+ gb these days. Some games easily surpass 100gb. Even with my better-than-average 300mbps connection games can easily take over an hour to download. No fucking way I’m only keeping 1-3 games and downloading as needed.
I guess an hour just isn’t a long time to me, I don’t have a lot of time to play games so I tend to plan ahead. I use the PS app to download games to my console remotely. With the numbers you’re saying, are you really suggesting that you’ve got something like 20-40 games that you need to be able to play at a moment’s notice? I’m honestly not trying to criticise I just can’t relate.
I haven’t built a new computer in awhile, but 4tb ssd would have costed more than the console when it launched would it have not? Unless you are saying they should have shipped with a hybrid SSD/HDD setup. Not sure if read/write speeds would hold up to the frame rates needed for their games now.
You can get a 4TB NVME SSD for 200 USD these days. And of course Sony wouldn’t pay retail price.
2TB, what Sony went for, does appear to have (just barely) the lowest price per GB right now though. $0.48/GB vs $0.52/GB for a cheap 4TB NVME SSD.
Honestly I’m surprised they didn’t also release a 4TB version. But I imagine they may release it later so they can get a second wave of PS5 Pro headlines later on.
I read it as the PS5, so launching November 2020 it should have come with a 4tb drive. The wording likely confused me
700 is insane. I guess I’ll wait for the PC release of Wolverine instead of playing it on the base PS5 then. Sony really shit the bed this cycle.
In the UK it works out as 913 USD.
Sounds like a lot more PC converts in the making.
They got off to a great start with the PS5, but as their lead grew over their only real direct competitor, they became a good example of the problems with monopolies all over again.
This is straight up back to PS3 launch all over again, as if they learned nothing.
Right on the tail end of a horribly mismanaged PSVR 2 launch.
We still barely have any current gen only games, and a $700 price point is insane for such a small library to actually make use of it.
Paystation
One big reason people still play on consoles to this day is because they own a physical copy of their games and can play on their consoles even offline.
Sometimes
Couch co-op is also a big thing that I want but fewer and fewer games offer it.
I couldn’t play Baldur’s Gate 3, a single-player game, when my internet went out. That pissed me right off.
That’s weird, I could.
If you pirated it you could have played it offline though. Paying customers get a worse experience than pirates
Yeah that’s what I meant by sometimes
Its becoming a trend where game companies are now making single player games require a internet connection just to play. I saw some games on Steam where single player games come with anti-cheat, like wtf.
Becoming a trend? This has been a regular frustration in gaming since the PS3 generation.
Could you give more details? On which platform did this happen?
Xbox series X. I couldn’t sign in to my profile, so the game wouldn’t load because I bought it electronically and it’s tied to my user. I sent them a little love letter for that.
Generally this works just fine if the console you are using is set to your “home console”. That’s what the home console toggle is for. I could see this being an issue if you have multiple consoles in your house, or you are game sharing with another profile.
I didn’t know this was a thing… I’ll look into that setting, thanks.
Lol, e-waste
IDK, something like this will probably be MOD. There’ll be minimal waste here.
Total waste of sand.
Seriously though. Just buy a shelf and spend all of your money on anime figurines if you want to collect something that can still contribute micro plastics to the oceans.
Hey Sony, I love you but you trolling?
