The Oregon case decided Friday is the most significant to come before the high court in decades on the issue and comes as a rising number of people in the U.S. are without a permanent place to live.
Class warfare scorecard.
Having more homes than you need even ones you never sleep in, legal.
Having zero homes and having to sleep on the streets, illegal.
What was their reason for this decision? Did they even give one. It’s time we remove the Supreme Court from office and put them in the street.
I’m certain someone offered them a gratuity
What was their reason for this decision?
Officially? Something mundane, I’m sure. Unofficially and actually? The “labor shortage” we have (which is actually people being reasonably unwilling to work abusive body-destroying soul-crushing senselessly-cruel jobs for less than poverty-level wages) is causing economic damage that’s visible in their portfolios, and a new massive infusion of slave labor (because prisoners can legally be used as slaves) that have no legal means to resist abuse and exploitation would fix that situation right up.
Anyone who can’t keep up with the numerous corporate money vacuums in their lives (rent, rent increases, bills, bill increases, taxes, more taxes, more bill increases, grocery cost increases, more utility increases, more more more) will become homeless, and the homeless will serve as our new pool of slave labor for dirt cheap. Keep up, hustle harder, pay more, pay faster, or be put in chains and tortured in solitary confinement with moldy nutriloaf until you agree to work to death for nothing.
This conservative wet dream is coming unless we collectively pull our heads out of our asses.
They post all their reasonings for every opinion on supremecourt.gov
In this case the tldr is the 8th amendment is concerned with the method or kind of punishment. And here it’s a limited fine for 1st time offenders, a court order prohibiting camping in parks, then to a max of 30 days in jail for people who violate that order.
Here’s the link to the full text: https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-175_19m2.pdf
That sounds reasonable until you remember that debtors prison is back, most states make people pay for their incarceration, and semi regular arrests are going to make sure you can’t keep a job to pay that “obligation”.
This is a backdoor into giving more people to the prison industry.
They aren’t trying to find what’s reasonable, they’re trying to find what the law says. There are a lot of stupid things that aren’t unconstitutional, like the death penalty. The majority operates on a ‘garbage in garbage out’ basis. We got a garbage outcome because they have a garbage law, and we haven’t gotten an amendment against it yet.
That said I wholly agree with the sentiment and message regarding the penal institutions we have. The attempts the find different ways to fund that correctional system are consistently producing negative outcomes. The state should bear it’s full weight so that they have incentive to maintain a low prison pop.
SCOTUS has absolutely set realist standards in the past. For example, gun regulations that are de facto bans are treated as such and declared unconstitutional.
They absolutely do not have to sit back and consign homeless people to the prison debt system while bemoaning their inability to enforce the 8th amendment.
The issue is the 8A is understood to have refered to the punishments being cruel or unusual, per the Court, not the offense. The actual punishments here (fine, court order, or 30 days in jail) are fairly normal for laws, the only odd thing about the statute is what the “crime” is.
The court chose that narrow view. They chose to naively interpret the punishment as ending and not transitioning into new forms that can dog people the rest of their lives. It is not something they were required to do. As the dissent points out.
The real reason is that conservative ideology dictates that society will have winners and losers who end up in the correct spot in the heirarchy if society doesn’t interfere with the natural sorting.
So it follows that homeless people don’t deserve a “handout” or a leg-up just because they squandered their opportunities.
Leftists think that an ideology follows from a moral interrogation of the world as it should be, whereas reactionaries think the highest good is done by ensuring that people are in their correct spot in the heirarchy in relation to others; since some people are inevitably going to be homeless, there isn’t much to be done about it and the leftists complaining about it are just virtue signaling to get votes.
Their justification is irrelevant once you realize the actual ideological reasoning.
Edit: I’m confused by the downvotes. Anyone want to tell me how I’m wrong? This isn’t my ideology, but I think it’s useful to understand your opposition on more than a cartoon-villain level, especially since they are so effective at selling their ideas to low-information voters.
I think you weren’t clear in delineation between leftist and reactionaries.
Ah, that makes sense. Thanks!
So. Unless you have permission to be on someone’s private real estate, to you’re now forbidden to sleep. Nothing dystopian about that.
Nonsense. I’m sure someone with a home and a job will be allowed to take a carnap on the quad of their public university. It’s only illegal to do it when you have to.
https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-175_19m2.pdf
Link to the opinion
You can predict the outcome of this court’s decisions with two questions:
A: Will it cause chaos?B: Is it cruel?
They seem to feel it’s bonus points if the answer to both is yes.
So, where are they supposed to sleep? In a jail cell?
In the case of CA, these people are going to be given in shelter beds. (I know, it sounds counterintuitive to the ruling.)
The main reason CA brought the case is because they aren’t allowed force portions of their unhoused populations indoors. They can’t move a segment of the population unless there is enough space for the entire population.
So, if a county had beds for half of the unhoused population, and it wanted to bring half of them indoors, it couldn’t. It could only make moves once it had beds for all.
I’m sure some place will be shitty and will just throw people in jail, but the big west cost cities have a lot of unfilled shelter beds that they would like to fill.
And all that being said, a lot of these unhoused people are avoiding shelters for a reason. Being on the street is actually preferable to what people experience in some shelters. So, as much as Newsom will tell you that he wants to be compassionate and give people a bed, he’s not telling you that bed is next to a psycho that’s going to scream all night then assault someone.
Yep! That way they can be used for slave labor for the owner class.
As well as to extract tax money from the working class. As it makes more economic sense to house and rehabilitate a person then it does to put them in jail. But the jail tends to have more kickbacks for the owner class.
At a far higher rate than actually employing them at the median income would be as well.
the median state spent $64,865 per prisoner for the year.
The only reason that companies want prison labor is because it is cheap for them since the taxpayers are subsidizing the labor costs.
Overall it would be cheaper for states to just pay the homeless the median income than to incarcerate them. A lower rate that could be described as a basic income that is implemented universally would go pretty far in both increasing the opportunities for the homeless to afford housing and reduce the chance of people from becoming homeless.
It’s that high to employ all the guards and construction and wardens and whatnot. A lot of hands are in that cookie jar.
See, this is the most frustrating part of the American homeless crisis. Literally the cheapest solution is to just build free housing.
The cheapest solution is to just fix the problem, but instead we choose to do more expensive things that don’t do anything to address the issue, but may possibly make it temporarily someone else’s problem.
Incarcerating them is a benefit for multiple terrible reasons!
- Cheap, state subsidized labor.
- Gets undesirables out of public spaces so fragile people don’t have to acknowledge their existence.
- Gives those in power ammunition in the form of incarceration rates for riling up the masses about ‘crime’.
- Gives undesirables a history of incarceration so they can be denied other things if they somehow get out of their situation.
- Gives undesirables a history of incarceration so they can be an easy suspect for criminal activity.
You don’t even have to build housing. The US has more vacant homes than it does homeless people.
I’m seeing people who are very likely homeless walking down busy highways and even the interstate to get to the town where I live, presumably to go to the jobs they still have despite being “lazy homeless people.” Walking down them miles out of town. They must have to walk for 2 or 3 hours minimum just to get to work. It would take them 2 hours to get to the nearest bus stop from where I often see them walking (near a woods where they must be camping).
A significant number of them are Latino, and this town does not have a large native Latino population, making me think they are migrants who ended up homeless after hoping to come to America for a better life.
I assume Republicans think all of that is just fine.
This is the ground work to start mass deportation during project 2025 when Trump wins.
Yes, and without what meager belongings they had prior to arrest. Any changes of clothes, tent, coats, bicycle, all gone.
I was hoping the ruling was narrow and that nuance would make available solutions to move forward, but no. This is a broad decision that allows criminalizing using a pillow in public (that is part of the law in Grants Pass, which was ruled as acceptable). Justice Sotomayor said it correctly: sleeping is a biological necessity. If you don’t have a place to sleep, you have to choose between not living and going to jail.
They’ll find a way to turn that into prison not jail.
Time to camp on SCOTUS lawns.
Sounds like the solution is for the homeless people to protest by refusing to sleep in shelters, forcing the police to arrest them all, overcrowding the jails and clogging the court system until the entire system grinds to a standstill.
So what do I know, I haven’t been homeless in 15 years
All the old Marijuana convictions being overturned means the corporate prison system has a shortage of free labor. Seems like jailing the homeless puts them back on top. Big Brain SCOTUS. /s
Jail = free labour
Shelter = help
Jail = makes $$$
Help = costs $
The math is clear.
Sounds like this will inevitably happen anyway. It’s not like they are bussing homeless people to Colorado are they?
No actually, I am asking are they doing that, because I can see them doing that.
it’s not exactly a new thing, but yes. they’ve been trying to bus people as far as they can get away with.
Think I will donate some money and my homemade scarfs to a shelter this weekend. Clearly our Christian government isnt going to help guess it is up to us atheists.
I mean the “justification” used by the Christians who vote for this kind of thing is that it would be under for the government to take money from people to help others, and it’s up to each individual with money to give freely to support the poor, or whatever.
That’s what they say out loud, anyway. So they can blame atheists for not giving freely. Never mind that they tend to give less, but
Glad I walked away from that garbage faith. I have seriously heard their shamans claim that they can be awful to immigrants because the direct biblical commandments to be nice to immigrants only apply to converts and since most immigrants are Christian they don’t count.
People arguing that you get to treat your own worse. It takes a special kinda fucked up to not even have basic levels of loyalty to your own.
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And imma keep advocating for kicking those selfrighteous fuckwads off their collective benches so they can get a more upclose view of their shit
It’s not as if these folks can just go off into the woods and build a cabin. There’s no where to go that isn’t owned or protected. You gotta sleep somewhere, it’s not a choice, people need to sleep.
Next is extermination camps
Fucking conservatives
You probably don’t choose to be homeless, but you do choose where to put your tent.
Sleeping is a biological necessity. So is shitting. WHY CAN’T I SHIT WHEREVER I WANT?! America sucks.
For communities that do this, the goal is to…
A) Drive out the homeless so they go to other, more charitable communities, and become someone else’s problem, and then…
B) Point out the higher rate of homelessness (and higher taxes necessary to deal with it) in those other communities and say, “Look how awful those communities are!”
Or fuel the prison industrial complex sustaining a constant supply of slave labor and state funding for private prisons
This is the one.
