Regarding the sports bans, trans individuals do not generally get a significant advantage against their cis peers. In the case of trans women, they are often are at a detriment in sports due to the lack of testosterone in their body that’s naturally there even in cis women. We haven’t seen clear cases of trans individuals standing out against their cis peers consistently and the argument that excluding such a small group works both ways. Unless trans folks are somehow world-class by default, excluding them from their gendered sport is moot and if anything cruel.
One place I see compromise (at least with trans women, I have no idea how men’s sports handles trans men since they need to take Testosterone) is requiring a certain number of years of HRT. Those who just started HRT might have an advantage, but after a few years they are around the same level as or further behind their peers.
EDIT: I’m a tiny bit more conflicted now reading some other comments I’ve seen you make. I feel like you’re coming from a genuinely good place though. I hope you continue to expose yourself to different ideas and keep learning and growing. ^_^
EDIT 2: :barks like a sealion: iykyk
EDIT 3: My only regret is that I only have one downvote to give.
I’m supportive of trans people’s rights to be left the fuck alone, and to be treated equally. But I also get that there need to be safe spaces for women to exist without some shadow-of-a-doubt in the back of their mind. Yes, that’s exclusionary, but remember the “Man vs Bear” debate a few months back? There are lots of women who are legitimately less trusting of men than they are a wild animal who will maul your face off.
Yeah, I’m harsh with the way that I put things. I understand that; it’s a result of the harsh environment I grew up in as a kid. People who were raised more tenderly probably don’t like the way I speak about things. But I DO support LGBTQ individuals and their right to not be discriminated against; as best as I can reconcile that with my belief that women need places they can escape men entirely if needed.
There are lots of women who are legitimately less trusting of men than they are a wild animal who will maul your face off.
I’m not a man, and your original comment seems to agree with that, but this says otherwise. You would never use this excuse if you actually saw trans women as women.
as best as I can reconcile that with my belief that women need places they can escape men entirely if needed.
Then you should understand why I, a trans woman, would like to be included in the space matching my gender.
I grew up being taught to give guidance and tolerance to those who are ignorant or bigoted, but this is the end of my rope. Do better.
It’s not if I see trans women as women or not. It’s if anyone has that doubt in their mind, and others clearly do; and these things have to be set for the sake of the most people - and sorry, but there are still more people who feel unsafe with you in womens spaces than there are people like you who would otherwise be wronged by the decision.
… “It’s not if I see black people as people or not, it’s…”
That’s how you sound to me. I hope you realize that.
You see me as worth less than the average person simply because I’m different from the average person.
Fucking bigot. From the bottom of my heart, fuck you.
Welp, let’s do that thought exercise again, I’ll take what you said and apply it to another, larger, more widely-accepted minority:
“A black person is never going to be entered into the 400 meter dash, that’s just how the world works. The sooner you accept that, the better. That doesn’t mean he should be treated with any less respect. But it’s not going to change the first fact.”
Whenever I substitute the minority you chose, I find that you are vile and your opinion means nothing. You sound exactly like the racists and bigots that came before you.
EDIT: Also, I’m not your fucking mother and this is where I block you. If you want to be a better person, work on how you view the world. You can say you had an old-school upbringing, but we’re actively watching that be pushed out of society because it causes more harm than good. Your survivorship bias and ignorance is not a shield, moron.
Regarding the sports bans, trans individuals do not generally get a significant advantage against their cis peers. In the case of trans women, they are often are at a detriment in sports due to the lack of testosterone in their body that’s naturally there even in cis women. We haven’t seen clear cases of trans individuals standing out against their cis peers consistently and the argument that excluding such a small group works both ways. Unless trans folks are somehow world-class by default, excluding them from their gendered sport is moot and if anything cruel.
One place I see compromise (at least with trans women, I have no idea how men’s sports handles trans men since they need to take Testosterone) is requiring a certain number of years of HRT. Those who just started HRT might have an advantage, but after a few years they are around the same level as or further behind their peers.
EDIT: I’m a tiny bit more conflicted now reading some other comments I’ve seen you make. I feel like you’re coming from a genuinely good place though. I hope you continue to expose yourself to different ideas and keep learning and growing. ^_^
EDIT 2: :barks like a sealion: iykyk
EDIT 3: My only regret is that I only have one downvote to give.
I’m supportive of trans people’s rights to be left the fuck alone, and to be treated equally. But I also get that there need to be safe spaces for women to exist without some shadow-of-a-doubt in the back of their mind. Yes, that’s exclusionary, but remember the “Man vs Bear” debate a few months back? There are lots of women who are legitimately less trusting of men than they are a wild animal who will maul your face off.
Yeah, I’m harsh with the way that I put things. I understand that; it’s a result of the harsh environment I grew up in as a kid. People who were raised more tenderly probably don’t like the way I speak about things. But I DO support LGBTQ individuals and their right to not be discriminated against; as best as I can reconcile that with my belief that women need places they can escape men entirely if needed.
I’m not a man, and your original comment seems to agree with that, but this says otherwise. You would never use this excuse if you actually saw trans women as women.
Then you should understand why I, a trans woman, would like to be included in the space matching my gender.
I grew up being taught to give guidance and tolerance to those who are ignorant or bigoted, but this is the end of my rope. Do better.
Removed by mod
Removed, transphobia.
… “It’s not if I see black people as people or not, it’s…” That’s how you sound to me. I hope you realize that.
You see me as worth less than the average person simply because I’m different from the average person.
Fucking bigot. From the bottom of my heart, fuck you.
Removed by mod
Removed, beyond transphobia into a complete misunderstanding and miscategorization of trans issues.
Welp, let’s do that thought exercise again, I’ll take what you said and apply it to another, larger, more widely-accepted minority:
“A black person is never going to be entered into the 400 meter dash, that’s just how the world works. The sooner you accept that, the better. That doesn’t mean he should be treated with any less respect. But it’s not going to change the first fact.”
Whenever I substitute the minority you chose, I find that you are vile and your opinion means nothing. You sound exactly like the racists and bigots that came before you.
EDIT: Also, I’m not your fucking mother and this is where I block you. If you want to be a better person, work on how you view the world. You can say you had an old-school upbringing, but we’re actively watching that be pushed out of society because it causes more harm than good. Your survivorship bias and ignorance is not a shield, moron.