You know, DOGE, fascist president and corporations dictating what people can do, institutions being ruined, laws being ignored. Is there any way out of that or is it over? Is the USA done?
In the short term, yes.
If trump remains in office after this term, absolutely yes.
If we get a different admin - not just another republicrat trump clone - they’re going to have to spend an inordinate amount of time fixing all of trump’s fuckups. One of which should be restricting any wannabe monarch’s ability to rule by decree in the US. So yeah, we’re fucked, and we’re gonna have to spend a lot of effort getting unfucked, digging ourselves out of an oligarchy hole, instead of moving forward from a continually advancing starting point.
E: allies are already turning away from us, politically and economically. They’ll form new alliances and relationships that the US doesn’t get to be a part of, or at least won’t get a leading position in. Same with things like soft power from international aid. China will step in, maybe the EU or even Russia. We lose the goodwill, stability, and any economic “ins” we could have achieved with that soft power. We’re fucked in lots of ways.
Yeah no, this will be long term
First trump term, him fucking over all allies is something the allies could forgive. Second time, not so much. Allies now know they can’t rely on the US to be a trustworthy ally.
Trump already destroyed all soft power, he wants to reduce military spending by 50% too, so hard power will be down the drain as well.
Then he’s destroying the economy, he increased highcorruption like there is no tomorrow, he is destroying education and he is destroying all oversight on companies
He’s working hard on destroying democratic institutions too so forget fair elections, as if the US ever had any.
IMHO, the US will never recover from trump, and that is what it deserves. It always had the great chance to be truely great but it fucked itself around every corner trying to please the rich
he wants to reduce military spending by 50% too, so hard power will be down the drain as well.
You say this like it’s a bad thing
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mentally_ill_monarchs
Trump is the first very televised idiot for this list… Tho the people are even less sane for REelecting him
It’s some very good news if he’s indeed dramatically downsizing the military. Gives Canada and Mexico a fighting chance! Will Canada be USA’s next Vietnam experience?
Canadian Moose Cavalry, anyone?
Depends how that happens. I’ld see them sell off lots of high tech gear to highest bidding crazy people for a quick cash grab. Same amount of weapons, less controlled.
We lose the goodwill
Gone. It’s gone. I’m your neighbor. There’s no more goodwill. It’s been completely replaced with desire to see your hubris teach a collective lesson, and a process of internal reflection on how we can not end up like you.
Hope you effectively learn that lesson. I don’t blame any country for turning away from the US. Stupid people electing destructive narcissists and doing absolutely nothing to prevent it.
3 generations of people ‘voting according to their pocketbooks’ makes an easily controlled monoculture.
Their pocketbooks were morons for three generations, too.
a process of internal reflection on how we can not end up like you.
Better focus on that really hard, because the rise of far-right parties around the world shows a lot of people are heading in the same direction. Absolutely condemn us, but watch your own back yards as well.
My country looked up to the US as a charismatic winner with a big ego and an anger problem, who turned full coked up psychopath now. I listened to the Fall of Civilizations-Podcast a lot and this feels like one. It’s scary to watch and I feel sorry for all the good people living in this mess. But I agree, there is no sympathy left. Let the raging insanity humble the evil empire.
Is your country Germany? Please don’t repeat our mistakes AND the mistakes of your past! The AfD gaining ground is very worrisome.
We’re kin. Fall of civ is my dystopian lullaby. I can hear that piano refrain, but it’s about us now.
I read an interview with the guy, he said that there are only a few fallen civilizations left to talk about and that he wants to end his podcast with an episode about us and our (first time ever) global civilization. Looking forward to that.
On the other hand, I read and listened to Kim Stanley Robinson a lot. In this podcast, he explains why he doesn’t want to write dystopian novels, that they comfortably trap our mind. That we need utopian stories to not give up and let them™ win. I think he has a point.
During my lifetime, the view people have of the US has completely changed.
It used to be “When I grow up, I want to move there.” and “Oh, you went to the US on vacation? AWESOME”.
Now it’s “Why the fuck would you go there, are you stupid?”Agreed on all counts.
I mean, don’t be so defeatist. Thats what they want you to feel.
We still have a last line of defence: Federalism.
We’d just have to hope the Democratic governors have the spine to stand up against Federal tyranny when the time comes, when they use the military against the people. And it’s up to the people in the 50 State’s National Guard, and law enforcement, and the military to decide between the constitution and fascism.
As for the federal firings, that’s not something that state governments can do anything about, so that’s unstoppable. But if you are talking about soldiers on the streets nazi style, probably not happening yet. We still have a bit of time to change course.
I’ll tell you this: if the 2026 midterms elections is cancelled, or if republicans win both houses, there’s probably no hope (since the opposition usually gains during midterms). That’s just civil war, and you’ll have to hope the pro-constitution side wins the civil war.
TLDR: You’ll have to hope elections still exist, and hope that democrats win in 2026, hopefully both houses. And also they’ll have to win 2028 with a trifecta.
And States run elections btw, the federal government will literally have to deploy troops to stop elections. And the governors can try to use the National Guard to blockcade federal troops from entering.
Hmmm, it seems the modern way for autocracies to deal with elections is to control the information space. I don’t see election being called off, but major social media platforms boosting one side while attenuating the other goes a long way. We know Musk is all in on this and the other big players like Zuckerberg & Co seem all too happy to oblige. Tiktok is an open ended question at this point.
Hmmm, it seems the modern way for autocracies to deal with elections is to control the information space.
So there is two different types (from how I understant it):
One is that elections are just completely fraudulent
The other has legitimate elections (as in, they actually count the votes and not make up numbers) but with a strong propaganda machine that favors the government.
Russia is the first type
Turkey is the second type
I think the USA would become more of a Turkey situation than a Russia situation
And it’s up to the people in the 50 State’s National Guard, and law enforcement, and the military to decide between the constitution and fascism.
Okay but you do remember we were here before and the national guard and law enforcement extremely made it very clear who’s side they were on… right?
Yes I know. They are right wing, they always have been.
Even when the miliary affirmed Biden’s victory, that was a right wing military doing so.
The questions is: How far will they go.
If you were talking about Jan 6, that’s because trump was in control of the national guard so he obviously didn’t call them in, since he plotted it himself.
Americans have always grew up learning the idea of “Rule of Law”. If trump (or whoever is president in 2028) cancels elections and they receive orders to march into polling stations to shut them down. That would conflict their worldview of “Rule of Law”.
Its one thing for trump to do a Jan 6. He has plausible deniability (at least in the eyes of the right-wing). He didn’t directly say “Go Storm The Capital”. He implied it. So its easy for the people in the militaey to say “well he didn’t intend for that to happen”.
Getting an order to literally stop voting from taking place will probably make them have a “Are we the baddies” moment.
Of couse, some will still obey orders. But not all. We just have to hope that enough will disobey orders
The fact thats only as far back as you went is sorta my point.
Yall dont remember before that, when Trump last was president as well, the crowds getting kettlepotted and gassed out, the peaceful crowds getting dispersed just so trump could take a photo op?
the crowds getting kettlepotted and gassed out, the peaceful crowds getting dispersed just so trump could take a photo op?
Suppressing protests have happened throughout US history, it’s nothing new.
Civil Rights, Unions, Strikes, Vietnam War Protests, etc… Americans would’ve desensitized and gotten used to it that it is wasn’t gonna raise any red flags.
What does that have to do with my original statement.
I feel like Trump could just make up any half assed excuse for why the voting stations need to be shut down though and they’d buy it.
Like it Trump says it, it is rule of law to them
Okay I’m gonna go offtopic and give you anecdotes
My parents are CCP sympathizers, yet they defied the one child policy and gave birth to me, the second child in the family.
In recent events, in China, the CCP has high approval rating, yet people got tired of all the lockdowns and people protested against the “Zero Covid” policy and that probably is the reason why the CCP ended the Zero Covid policy.
My point is, these conservatives aren’t as loyal as you think they are.
Honestly democrats have been spouting off about how dangerous republicans are but when push comes to shove they serve up the same bills but somehow even worse and them drink tea with the fascists.
The dems better get real fuckin lefty real quick if they ever want to win an election again. But they wontt, they’ll just emulate dump even more like they did with Reagan.
The last time the economy crashed, the US got 40 years of progressivism. Hopefully we get something out of this fucking bullshit
Hopefully we get something out of this fucking bullshit
At the current trajectory, it be at best a renewed appreciation for how good things used to be.
/r Collapse warned us…
Yes and and beyond screwed.
We got all this dooming 8 years ago as well. We were fine then, we will be fine now.
We were not fine then and neither are we now
They literally attempted a coup when they lost the election, so no, everything was not “fine”.
The precious norms!
Haha stupid libs and their “peaceful transfer of power”. I want to rule the disgusting poor’s with an iron fist! THEY WILL KNOW MY SUPREMITY AMD MY REIGN OF
TERRORCOMPASSION WILL KNOW NO END!least incoherent shitlib
False.
The people that define these things disagree with you: https://clinecenter.illinois.edu/coup-detat-project/statement_dec.15.2022
That’s not webster’s dictionary. Here, let me link it. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/coup And if you’re feeling lazy, here’s the definition: 1 : a sudden decisive exercise of force in politics and especially the violent overthrow or alteration of an existing government by a small group : coup d’état
Since Trump didn’t attempt to overthrow anything, and he certainly didn’t use force, he didn’t attempt a coup.
Glad we got that all cleared
Haha yeah. Websters dictionary is the sole arbiter of political upheaval and is the singular source of authority on all events, past and present.
Its not like there could possibly be any grey zone on what is or is not a coup. That would require critical thinking and an organization that catalogs and studies such events. That would be ridiculous! Oh wait
They didn’t have a Project 2017 then. The situation is very different.
From the outside looking in, I have to say that the pace of things this time around is pretty alarming.
They absolutely did have all those goals then
Upvoted for the optimism. Let’s hope you’re right.
Yeah.
I wont give a knee jerk response to it. a country the size, economy, and history of USA doesn’t get done for by one President. While Muskrump will cause plenty of institutional damage and suffering on American and global populace, USA will come out stronger and better nation at the end of this (whenever this ends). Case in point, Germany before WWII and Germany after WWII
Define done? Even if the government gets completely dismantled in the short term, who knows what will happen in 10 years time. It will definitely take longer than that to rebuild our position of authority and influence in the global stage, if we ever achieve that, but it’s definitely doable in our lifetimes.
Yeah, good luck with that.
We don’t want your “authority and influence” any more. The US has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that they cannot be trusted with the power they’ve got.
to rebuild our position of authority and influence in the global stage
…it’s definitely doable in our lifetimes.Nope. It would take 20 years to rebuild the soft power, connections and goodwill the US has now lost.
But in 20 years, China will have taken over the role the US used to have on the world stage.
They aren’t even the less moral option anymore.They aren’t even the less moral option anymore.
Never were.
Unless there’s a coup when the Supreme Court finds against Trump and he ignores them and Republicans keep Congress from holding him accountable the only way the Court will let them.
My brother sent this to me the other day and I gave it a watch. It feels pretty unbiased (although I’m uneducated), and seems to have a more macro, zoomed-out view of America and just nations on the whole. I thought it was pretty interesting and it helped to put some things in perspective.
As you failed to prevent fascism at the voting booth, you will have to learn how to stop it now. This is the situation the second amendment had been written for. After being abused to allow criminals and mentally retarded to get access to weapons they should never have, you can now put them to good use.
Screwed is always relative.
I’m hearing chat that immigrants from places like Turkey or India are going “oh yeah this is what it’s like back home”.
So it’s possible it just goes full neoliberal (i.e. no consequences or regulations for the rich) and the division of wealth grows even further.
Provided he doesn’t cause a war or some kind of other mass-death problem (chemical spills, reactor meltdown etc) it might just have a cost primarily in human suffering, as opposed to human life.
If we don’t get a handle on the debt it will be like Greece 2.0
How many realize Doge was originally a misspelling of Dodge, used to describe scams and confidence games?
Probably.
Although there’s a lot of knee-jerk reaction in some circles, Trump issuing EOs that are illegal and unenforceable only go as far as all the other vitriol that slides it’s way out of his mouth creases. Plenty of things he does are blocked by judges, including his demand that only him and his AG are allowed to interpret the law. It just doesn’t work like that. Although the possibility of things being escalated and allowed through a compromised supreme Court still exists, it hasn’t happened yet. I’m not giving into the mania while checks and balances still actually do exist.
Corporations dictating what people can do has been happening basically my whole life.
DOGE is another story. It’s very bad, yeah, but I’m not sure how it affects me personally in my day-to-day.
