Researchers at IMDEA Networks Institute, together with European partners, have found that tire pressure sensors in modern cars can unintentionally expose drivers to tracking. Over a ten-week study, they collected signals from more than 20,000 vehicles, revealing a hidden privacy risk and highlighting the need for stronger security measures in future vehicle sensor systems. Most...
I managed to drive cars for 30 years without a TPMS sensor and the only time I ever had a to check the pressure on a tire, was when I knew i had a leak and didn’t have time to fix it. I can also tell by the way my car drives if a tire is soft. I also had an air pump in my car powered by a cigarette lighter adapter that I could fill my tires.
My current car, from 2019 doesn’t have one. I’ve managed to own it 7 years (this week) without needing to check the pressure 2500 times.
The assertion you need to check your pressure everyday without a TPMS system is ridiculous.
If you didn’t check your tire pressure in the last 20 minutes how do you know you didn’t just drive over a nail and get a slow leak? TPMS checks every few seconds so you know when there is a small problem. Anyone will notice a fully flat tire, but a lot of people used to drive on low tire pressure for months without knowing. Once someone knew their tire had a problem they would check daily (until they got it fixed), but many people never knew in the first place, and even though who did know often took a week before they found out - they of course have no way to know since nobody checked their tire pressure daily much less every 20 minutes.
Low tire pressure is not a safety issue, more of a efficiency issue, until it is so low that you’d need to be paying ZERO attention to the car’s handling to not notice. Lower pressure actually increases performance (to a point, and depending on the tire) because it can allow more rubber to contact the road. It is pretty typical to air down to around 20 psi for performance driving even if it’s closer to 35 for daily driving.
It’s very easy to notice if one tire loses pressure because you’ll have a very strong pull to one side, almost like a bad alignment. I got my tires rotated at a shop and they deflated the tires for some reason and forgot to refill one of them. On my way home I was freaking out that they fucked my alignment because it was handling so weird on the suburban roads home (not even twisty performance driving). My TPMS didn’t even go off until I was basically home already. When I checked the tire it was maybe 15 or 20. Certainly not dangerous but also certainly noticeable.
I’ve been driving for 30 years. Do you want to guess how many times that’s happened to me?
Meanwhile, I’ve apparently been living in a totalitarian surveillance state for at least a few years now, and you know how many times that’s happened to me? I’ll give you a hint, it’s more than the number of times I’ve run over a nail causing me to drive around on low tire pressure without knowing it.
What matters is the whole community. Statistically it happens to someone in your community. Society wasted a lot of fuel (read global warming) just on low tire pressure.
That may have been the intention but I doubt it ever worked as effectively as they claimed it would. Besides, it will probably cost at least 1 AI data-center of carbon emissions to continuously surveil all these people with TPMS sensors, so the argument could be made that you’re actually reducing carbon pollution at this point by removing yours.
Have you met people? Do you think that battered old Chevy is driven by someone who cares about the TPMS light? They can ignore it as effectively as the check engine light.
The fact that you’ve gotten away with it is not proof that it’s unnecessary. The fact that it was legally mandated is good evidence that it is. These systems save lives, no question about it.
The fact that it was legally mandated is good evidence that it is.
but their point was laws are not always made with good intentions and safety in mind. that’s not to say TPMS is required for secret surveillance, but that there being a law for it does not immediately mean there’s good purpose for that law.
Do you believe law and ethics are separable? Does your “these systems save lives” not speak to the very reasoning employed to codify an ethical position into the law of the land?
What a shockingly wrong take. TPMS is a convenience, not a safety measure, have properly inflated tires is. And, anyone who properly maintains their car, doesn’t need it
And, it’s not legally mandated everywhere, even if it is for you.
What an incredibly bad take. Indeed, having properly inflated tires is a safety issue. How do you know if they’re properly inflated? Are you checking them every 3 minutes while driving? Because TPMS is…
It concludes that even if you increased grip, which includes tire pressure variance, by 15%, it would only represent a reduction of 2% of road related fatalities, which is actually within the margin of error.
While 2% sounds like a lot, GIDAS also shows that tire failures account for less than 1% of road accidents causing death.
So you’re spending $300 to $500 on a new car for a TPMS which reduces the probability of accidental death by 0.02%.
And fun fact, most tire related accidents are actually from tread depth, not low pressure, and TPMS will do fuck all to tell you your tread depth is low.
They didn’t come with my car. My car does not have a TPMS sensor. Your “every car comes with them” statement is blatantly false.
And, I am not insulting you, if anything I am sad for you. I made what I believe is an honest assessment of your intellectual capabilities based on your lack of understanding with how parts inside an automobile are priced and the nonsensical responses you have given to cogent points.
It doesn’t matter if it’s mandated for inclusion where you live, that doesn’t mean it’s free. You are paying for it. In fact, you are paying for sensors ti replaced multiple times over the life of the vehicle, another thing which most people won’t do. So, every 3 to 8 years (depending on various factors), you have to replace the TPMS sensors, pay another $300 to $500 for something which does sweet fuck all for your safety.
I managed to drive cars for 30 years without a TPMS sensor and the only time I ever had a to check the pressure on a tire, was when I knew i had a leak and didn’t have time to fix it. I can also tell by the way my car drives if a tire is soft. I also had an air pump in my car powered by a cigarette lighter adapter that I could fill my tires.
My current car, from 2019 doesn’t have one. I’ve managed to own it 7 years (this week) without needing to check the pressure 2500 times.
The assertion you need to check your pressure everyday without a TPMS system is ridiculous.
If you didn’t check your tire pressure in the last 20 minutes how do you know you didn’t just drive over a nail and get a slow leak? TPMS checks every few seconds so you know when there is a small problem. Anyone will notice a fully flat tire, but a lot of people used to drive on low tire pressure for months without knowing. Once someone knew their tire had a problem they would check daily (until they got it fixed), but many people never knew in the first place, and even though who did know often took a week before they found out - they of course have no way to know since nobody checked their tire pressure daily much less every 20 minutes.
Low tire pressure is not a safety issue, more of a efficiency issue, until it is so low that you’d need to be paying ZERO attention to the car’s handling to not notice. Lower pressure actually increases performance (to a point, and depending on the tire) because it can allow more rubber to contact the road. It is pretty typical to air down to around 20 psi for performance driving even if it’s closer to 35 for daily driving.
It’s very easy to notice if one tire loses pressure because you’ll have a very strong pull to one side, almost like a bad alignment. I got my tires rotated at a shop and they deflated the tires for some reason and forgot to refill one of them. On my way home I was freaking out that they fucked my alignment because it was handling so weird on the suburban roads home (not even twisty performance driving). My TPMS didn’t even go off until I was basically home already. When I checked the tire it was maybe 15 or 20. Certainly not dangerous but also certainly noticeable.
I’ve been driving for 30 years. Do you want to guess how many times that’s happened to me?
Meanwhile, I’ve apparently been living in a totalitarian surveillance state for at least a few years now, and you know how many times that’s happened to me? I’ll give you a hint, it’s more than the number of times I’ve run over a nail causing me to drive around on low tire pressure without knowing it.
Longer than that for me. Never happened, but I do not run tires more than 8 years old, regardless of mileage.
What matters is the whole community. Statistically it happens to someone in your community. Society wasted a lot of fuel (read global warming) just on low tire pressure.
Surveillance is a problem. So is global warming.
That may have been the intention but I doubt it ever worked as effectively as they claimed it would. Besides, it will probably cost at least 1 AI data-center of carbon emissions to continuously surveil all these people with TPMS sensors, so the argument could be made that you’re actually reducing carbon pollution at this point by removing yours.
Have you met people? Do you think that battered old Chevy is driven by someone who cares about the TPMS light? They can ignore it as effectively as the check engine light.
You clearly need a TPMS if you aren’t smart enough to detect when your car pulls to one side, drags, or makes a loud FWAPFWAPFWAP sound.
I am suspicious of that being the motivation behind this.
The fact that you’ve gotten away with it is not proof that it’s unnecessary. The fact that it was legally mandated is good evidence that it is. These systems save lives, no question about it.
lots of things are legally mandated without any good evidence.
Lots of things legally mandated in the past are now unconscionable or illegal now.
Legal != effective or ethical, that is an unbelievably stupid argument for TPMS.
LOL who said anything about ethics? This is an unbelievably stupid response.
indeed, you said this:
but their point was laws are not always made with good intentions and safety in mind. that’s not to say TPMS is required for secret surveillance, but that there being a law for it does not immediately mean there’s good purpose for that law.
Indeed, that had nothing to do with ethics.
Do you believe law and ethics are separable? Does your “these systems save lives” not speak to the very reasoning employed to codify an ethical position into the law of the land?
What a shockingly wrong take. TPMS is a convenience, not a safety measure, have properly inflated tires is. And, anyone who properly maintains their car, doesn’t need it
And, it’s not legally mandated everywhere, even if it is for you.
What an incredibly bad take. Indeed, having properly inflated tires is a safety issue. How do you know if they’re properly inflated? Are you checking them every 3 minutes while driving? Because TPMS is…
Because I was bored
GIDAS data
https://www.ircobi.org/wordpress/downloads/irc0111/2009/Session2/2_3.pdf
It concludes that even if you increased grip, which includes tire pressure variance, by 15%, it would only represent a reduction of 2% of road related fatalities, which is actually within the margin of error.
While 2% sounds like a lot, GIDAS also shows that tire failures account for less than 1% of road accidents causing death.
So you’re spending $300 to $500 on a new car for a TPMS which reduces the probability of accidental death by 0.02%.
And fun fact, most tire related accidents are actually from tread depth, not low pressure, and TPMS will do fuck all to tell you your tread depth is low.
It’s nothing to do with grip. In fact, a lower tire pressure will actually increase grip.
Oh well if no one died it must not be a safety issue?
Uhhh nope, it comes with the car…
So we’re just going to ignore it as a safety issue because it’s not a main cause of collisions?
Removed by mod
Your personal insults are only reflecting poorly on you.
They come with the car. Every car. Doesn’t matter how much they cost. They are not optional. It is not a choice your can make.
They didn’t come with my car. My car does not have a TPMS sensor. Your “every car comes with them” statement is blatantly false.
And, I am not insulting you, if anything I am sad for you. I made what I believe is an honest assessment of your intellectual capabilities based on your lack of understanding with how parts inside an automobile are priced and the nonsensical responses you have given to cogent points.
It doesn’t matter if it’s mandated for inclusion where you live, that doesn’t mean it’s free. You are paying for it. In fact, you are paying for sensors ti replaced multiple times over the life of the vehicle, another thing which most people won’t do. So, every 3 to 8 years (depending on various factors), you have to replace the TPMS sensors, pay another $300 to $500 for something which does sweet fuck all for your safety.
Because I am not a complete fucking idiot.