@Hazdaz I kind of feel like the GOP has imploded, though. Since Trump especially (and really I think this strain of anti-democracy conservativism dates back to the 2000 election where they saw that they could just bully their way into stealing elections), there doesn’t seem to be much of the Republican Party that preceeded him left. Now it’s all antidemocratic fascists and nutjobs. Just because they call themselves Republicans and win elections doesn’t mean their politics really has anything to do with what their party stands for on paper.
I think it’s more a case of being careful what you wish for. Yes, they imploded. Yes, they don’t really exist anymore. What has supplanted them is so much worse
I really hate this perspective. It’s just plain wrong.
Trump DID NOT change the Republican party. He only made them think the mask was no longer necessary. They’ve been pro war, pro tax cuts, pro business, pro rich, pro racism, and anti-democracy… for literally decades.
Now that they’re not using platitudes and not couching their rhetoric in obvious lies it’s suddenly evil?!
Hell, he wasn’t even the first time they rioted after losing an election. That happened in 2000, when paid republican operatives disrupted the recount that would have confirmed al gore as president long enough for the supreme court to step in and award the state (and, therefore, the presidency) to dubya without counting the votes at all. Google ‘brooks brothers riot’, several Republican staffers openly acknowledge that they were there to use violence in order to stop the votes from being counted despite initial claims that they were only there to observe the process and ensure that it was fair. This includes congressman John Sweeney, who said “What I essential told my people was ‘You’ve got to stop them.’” Trump thought he could get away with this because Bush already had gotten away with it. They even planned copycat riots in Arizona and Nevada in 2020 because it worked the first time.
In the last 30 years Republicans have won the presidency 3 times despite having only gotten more votes than the other guy once. They have had two riots after elections, one of which successfully delayed counting votes long enough for the Republican to be installed as president, and one which failed to delay certification long enough to install the Republican. They are against democracy and in favor of violence. They consistently act with those values in mind. They are enemies of democracy and freedom.
That happened in 2000, when paid republican operatives disrupted the recount that would have confirmed al gore as president long enough for the supreme court to step in and award the state (and, therefore, the presidency) to dubya without counting the votes at all. Google ‘brooks brothers riot’
It just completely blows my mind that this happened and, more so, that it was allowed to stand after the fact. I think I read somewhere that Gore decided not to contest it in order to not mess with the peaceful transfer of power, but man…
Just imagine how world events had played out if Al Gore had been president on and after September 11th, 2001. Imagine the progress we could have made on climate change 24 years ago. I understand that it’s pure speculation, that he could have been a lukewarm president. But come on, he would have been loads better that GWB even if all he did was twirl his fingers.
Absolutely based post. I’ve recognized what they truly were 20 years ago. There is a slight distinction - the republican party always had 4 stools (people used to say three stools but I never agreed).
First stool is the wealthy just wanting to make more money (tax cuts, tax welfare, regulation capture, etc). This is the true stool in power pulling the strings of all the other stools. They know they can never win a popular vote (why would the workers vote to lower their own wages?). They ride the Santa sled with the big bag of money, the reigns are connected to the lesser stools, and they ride that sled into the bank
Second stool is the religious vote - really captured by Reagan I believe with the invention of the abortion issue, but they go as far back as Goldwater I believe, because he warned about them. These are the reindeer of the money sled
Third stool is the racists, the KKK types in the south. These are also the reindeer
Fourth stool is what I consider the conspiracy theory crowd - they sort of share the stool with the uneducated morons who can’t seem to figure out what their best interests are (“get gobernment off my Medicare, vote republican”). This stool might fall under the “undecided” crowd by some metrics, but they fall victim to the usual right wing lies and propaganda all the fucking time, so I don’t see why we can’t just label them as they truly are, the useful idiot voters of the republican propaganda arm
As a whole, these groups are the same pieces of shit that love Trump because he’s talks to them with a bullhorn, not through dog whistles like previous republicans, that’s the difference some of you might not appreciate
Edit - one distinction I think is needed is the people who fell for the dog whistles were usually of the authoritarian/fascist type. For example, There were pretty decent religious people or business people who felt the wrong message was being presented by the republican party, but the authoritarians/fascists always fell in line behind the republicans/conservatives. Still the case today
Your fourth stool I think probably should be combined with gun owners & 2nd amendment folks as well. There’s been a persistent conspiracy theory that gets trotted out every year or so that Democrats are coming for their guns, though it’s not exactly a conspiracy, but the way it’s portrayed is as if it’s the first stage of Democratic Socialist Fascists kicking in your door and raping your grandma.
Yes, I think the 4th stool is shared by the single issue voter crowd - it’s sort of an umbrella, but it still in major part are the people who fall for the propaganda; say 2nd amendment issue, or trans bathroom issue, or Critical Race Theory (although that might be more of a 3rd stool strategy), or whatever the next wedge issue the right wing media industrial complex thinks of - these people will fall for it EVERY SINGLE TIME. Just major inability to understand nuance and complete lack of critical thinking, whatever the case may be (I’m sure we can talk about this 4th stool a lot. I would love to find a way to cogently sum them up)
Yeah, I feel like the Republican Party has evolved (or devolved) into what they are now, but it’s not like they hadn’t already been moving in this direction anyways, he accelerated it if anything. Trump took advantage of a Party that wanted a “strongman”, he brought the racism, billionaire businessman background, toxic masculinity and performances you might normally see in wrestling back room drama or talk radio, and a feigned devotion to the Church (that was probably his weakest trait, thus Mike Pence). He brought together a lot of elements of the Republican Party that were already all there, just not really ever focused in one person with such a shitty moral compass and motivation to take advantage of the GOP. Pre-Trump, the GOP has mostly had boring business people like George Bush, Mitt Romney, Bob Dole, and Newt Gingrich and others, nobody really “inspiring” to them like Ronald Reagan.
They would’ve done the same things, especially if they got the supreme court stacked like Trump did but without the extra drama.
It’d just be Mitt Romney spouting about protecting marriage and family values from erosion by all those miscreants instead of ol’ Marge TG spouting off about the drag queens grooming your kids at the library.
If anything, it’s actually a blessing Trump pulled the mask off. Now, only the truly dense or selfish fail to understand or admit how vile the Republican “leadership” is.
They’ve gotten more bold, yes, but it is CRITICAL to remember that these are the same conservatives with the same values they’ve had all along. They NEVER actually supported democracy. They just wanted to stay out of jail, and Trump made them think they might actually get away with it.
@Hazdaz I kind of feel like the GOP has imploded, though. Since Trump especially (and really I think this strain of anti-democracy conservativism dates back to the 2000 election where they saw that they could just bully their way into stealing elections), there doesn’t seem to be much of the Republican Party that preceeded him left. Now it’s all antidemocratic fascists and nutjobs. Just because they call themselves Republicans and win elections doesn’t mean their politics really has anything to do with what their party stands for on paper.
I think it’s more a case of being careful what you wish for. Yes, they imploded. Yes, they don’t really exist anymore. What has supplanted them is so much worse
@YoBuckStopsHere
I really hate this perspective. It’s just plain wrong.
Trump DID NOT change the Republican party. He only made them think the mask was no longer necessary. They’ve been pro war, pro tax cuts, pro business, pro rich, pro racism, and anti-democracy… for literally decades.
Now that they’re not using platitudes and not couching their rhetoric in obvious lies it’s suddenly evil?!
Hell, he wasn’t even the first time they rioted after losing an election. That happened in 2000, when paid republican operatives disrupted the recount that would have confirmed al gore as president long enough for the supreme court to step in and award the state (and, therefore, the presidency) to dubya without counting the votes at all. Google ‘brooks brothers riot’, several Republican staffers openly acknowledge that they were there to use violence in order to stop the votes from being counted despite initial claims that they were only there to observe the process and ensure that it was fair. This includes congressman John Sweeney, who said “What I essential told my people was ‘You’ve got to stop them.’” Trump thought he could get away with this because Bush already had gotten away with it. They even planned copycat riots in Arizona and Nevada in 2020 because it worked the first time.
In the last 30 years Republicans have won the presidency 3 times despite having only gotten more votes than the other guy once. They have had two riots after elections, one of which successfully delayed counting votes long enough for the Republican to be installed as president, and one which failed to delay certification long enough to install the Republican. They are against democracy and in favor of violence. They consistently act with those values in mind. They are enemies of democracy and freedom.
It just completely blows my mind that this happened and, more so, that it was allowed to stand after the fact. I think I read somewhere that Gore decided not to contest it in order to not mess with the peaceful transfer of power, but man…
Just imagine how world events had played out if Al Gore had been president on and after September 11th, 2001. Imagine the progress we could have made on climate change 24 years ago. I understand that it’s pure speculation, that he could have been a lukewarm president. But come on, he would have been loads better that GWB even if all he did was twirl his fingers.
MLK Jr DID warn everyone about the complacency of the comfortable… Too bad people suck at listening to difficult but good advice.
Absolutely based post. I’ve recognized what they truly were 20 years ago. There is a slight distinction - the republican party always had 4 stools (people used to say three stools but I never agreed).
First stool is the wealthy just wanting to make more money (tax cuts, tax welfare, regulation capture, etc). This is the true stool in power pulling the strings of all the other stools. They know they can never win a popular vote (why would the workers vote to lower their own wages?). They ride the Santa sled with the big bag of money, the reigns are connected to the lesser stools, and they ride that sled into the bank
Second stool is the religious vote - really captured by Reagan I believe with the invention of the abortion issue, but they go as far back as Goldwater I believe, because he warned about them. These are the reindeer of the money sled
Third stool is the racists, the KKK types in the south. These are also the reindeer
Fourth stool is what I consider the conspiracy theory crowd - they sort of share the stool with the uneducated morons who can’t seem to figure out what their best interests are (“get gobernment off my Medicare, vote republican”). This stool might fall under the “undecided” crowd by some metrics, but they fall victim to the usual right wing lies and propaganda all the fucking time, so I don’t see why we can’t just label them as they truly are, the useful idiot voters of the republican propaganda arm
As a whole, these groups are the same pieces of shit that love Trump because he’s talks to them with a bullhorn, not through dog whistles like previous republicans, that’s the difference some of you might not appreciate
Edit - one distinction I think is needed is the people who fell for the dog whistles were usually of the authoritarian/fascist type. For example, There were pretty decent religious people or business people who felt the wrong message was being presented by the republican party, but the authoritarians/fascists always fell in line behind the republicans/conservatives. Still the case today
Your fourth stool I think probably should be combined with gun owners & 2nd amendment folks as well. There’s been a persistent conspiracy theory that gets trotted out every year or so that Democrats are coming for their guns, though it’s not exactly a conspiracy, but the way it’s portrayed is as if it’s the first stage of Democratic Socialist Fascists kicking in your door and raping your grandma.
Yes, I think the 4th stool is shared by the single issue voter crowd - it’s sort of an umbrella, but it still in major part are the people who fall for the propaganda; say 2nd amendment issue, or trans bathroom issue, or Critical Race Theory (although that might be more of a 3rd stool strategy), or whatever the next wedge issue the right wing media industrial complex thinks of - these people will fall for it EVERY SINGLE TIME. Just major inability to understand nuance and complete lack of critical thinking, whatever the case may be (I’m sure we can talk about this 4th stool a lot. I would love to find a way to cogently sum them up)
He killed their euphemisms
Yeah, I feel like the Republican Party has evolved (or devolved) into what they are now, but it’s not like they hadn’t already been moving in this direction anyways, he accelerated it if anything. Trump took advantage of a Party that wanted a “strongman”, he brought the racism, billionaire businessman background, toxic masculinity and performances you might normally see in wrestling back room drama or talk radio, and a feigned devotion to the Church (that was probably his weakest trait, thus Mike Pence). He brought together a lot of elements of the Republican Party that were already all there, just not really ever focused in one person with such a shitty moral compass and motivation to take advantage of the GOP. Pre-Trump, the GOP has mostly had boring business people like George Bush, Mitt Romney, Bob Dole, and Newt Gingrich and others, nobody really “inspiring” to them like Ronald Reagan.
Please use Satan’s full title, Ronald “Genocidal Astrology Fascist” Reagan.
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They would’ve done the same things, especially if they got the supreme court stacked like Trump did but without the extra drama.
It’d just be Mitt Romney spouting about protecting marriage and family values from erosion by all those miscreants instead of ol’ Marge TG spouting off about the drag queens grooming your kids at the library.
If anything, it’s actually a blessing Trump pulled the mask off. Now, only the truly dense or selfish fail to understand or admit how vile the Republican “leadership” is.
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They’ve gotten more bold, yes, but it is CRITICAL to remember that these are the same conservatives with the same values they’ve had all along. They NEVER actually supported democracy. They just wanted to stay out of jail, and Trump made them think they might actually get away with it.