Media reports said as much as $700 billion could be allocated to Europe's defenses, though it was not clear how much of that amount would go to Kyiv.

Summary

European officials are preparing a multibillion-dollar defense package to bolster regional security and support Ukraine, announced by German Foreign Minister Annalena Baerbock at the Munich Security Conference.

The package, potentially valued up to 700 billion euros, will fund military training, arms deliveries, and security guarantees amid concerns over Russian aggression and diminishing U.S. contributions to NATO.

The move follows calls for Europe to boost its own defense spending while U.S.-Russian talks, which exclude Ukraine and Europe, on ending the Ukraine conflict continue.

  • orgrinrt@lemmy.worldEnglish
    2·
    3 days ago

    The thing is, there are no ideal options here. While the 700bn goes to violence, at least in my country I know for a fact it goes to defense, since we very explicitly have no general armed forces, only defense forces. The same is not true for Russia or the US.

    But I suppose you are right in that it depends on the specific country. I’m from a progressive social democracy, the world’s happiest people multiple years in row according to some studies, so it’s easy for me to say I’d rather choose the current situation over getting Russia or US conditions here… but maybe the same is not true for all European countries. There are many, after all, and in case of Hungary, for example, I would probably feel the same as you. There wouldn’t be much of a difference, just the flavor of who gets to oppress you and your people.

    But there is no choice here, in my country, in which the current social situation remains as good as it is here, and in which we also do not spend any money on defense, local as well as Europe at large.

    If the choice is between oppressive leadership, I’d much rather choose my current flavor. People can be who they are here, there’s no militia silencing our voices, and while things could be better in a million different ways, they also could be so much worse, as demonstrated by the two dickswingers, Russia and USA.

    In an ideal world we would not spend on violence. I agree with that. It’s a waste. It leads to people dying, especially innocents. But it’s not an ideal world. And until it is, the choice has to be between different flavors of bad, I suppose, and personally I would 100% always choose the flavor in which I feel safe, happy and supported as a gender identity and sexual minority with mental health problems and adhd. And I would hope that most would do the same.

    Because the alternative is just going to be fatal for me, at least, and a lot of people like me.

    Edit: And yeah, you can pick out my points and their details in many ways, but the fact that the alternative can be picked out in so many more ways, remains. It’s all relative. I don’t see it as a good option to sacrifice good, just because it is not perfect, and get an outright horrible outcome. I’d much rather just try and help things remain at least good…

    Edit2: Also, to address the “everybody wants to invade you” part: The US has declared it will start expansion and assimilate parts of other sovereign countries. One of those being part of Europe… An European country is currently deep in a defense war against a nation that has also declared that letting my country gain independence was a mistake and that is listed in multiple writings of prominent leadership members as one of the next countries that will be part of Russia “again”. So I don’t think everyone wants to invade us, not by a long shot. But there are countries that have been very explicit in their want, or even need, to fucking invade us and start enrussificating us.

    The fact that you aren’t even considering these things, things that are well known and plainly and openly broadcast by these dickswingers, in some cases for many decades now, just tells me that you fail to understand what it actually is like being an openly stated target of assimilation. You make it a joke, as if nobody ever wants to conquer anyone, but it’s just fucking fantasy to think that. Right now, the same country that has stated my country “is in fact” part of their country, is, in real time, fighting a war of assimilation not too far from our borders… I get that this might not be close to you, you may live somewhere far away and don’t know this, but it hits a bit different when you are actually here. I can’t even imagine what it is like for Ukraine…

    I do hope you could also try and expand your point of view and gain some perspective. The world is fairly shit in terms of things like this. Pretending otherwise won’t change that. The moment you blink, the nazis and oligarchs just do what they already have told you, over and over, what they will do. And next thing you know, you are being raped in a prison for being “a deviant” and your murder is then hidden away as your peers continue to face this reality.