Summary
Despite his conservative platform, Donald Trump made unexpected gains among Gen Z voters. Exit polls showed a shift, with young men favoring Trump by 2 points, a reversal from Biden’s previous lead.
Gen Z’s support for Trump may have been underestimated, as an Axios poll found nearly half of Gen Z voters lied about their vote, with young men more likely to support Trump quietly.
Trump connected with young men through appearances on popular podcasts and endorsements from social media influencers.
Disillusionment with the economy and frustration with the Democratic Party’s approach to working-class issues also drove some Gen Z voters to seek change, with Trump capitalizing on these sentiments.
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I don’t see any silver linings in any of this.
Young men have become more right wing for sure.
I wonder why that is? The dems where marketing right at them?
There is a sizable group of young men who not only feel like the Democrats (and people on the left, in general) have not only ignored the issues they face, but view them as being inherently bad in some way. The alt-right spaces have been very successful at translating discussions of privilege into a message that everyone but the GOP believes young men, especially young, white men, are doing just fine and are greedy for demanding any sort of help or attention, as well as inherently being oppressors of the marginalized groups that have featured so prominently in contemporary discourse, with no way of redeeming themselves short of complete and total submission to these groups. Basically, painting white guilt on steroids as the only acceptable option for these young men to the Democrats, but with the caveat that nothing they do will ever absolve them of the crime of being born with a penis.
This is obviously nonsense, but it’s quite attractive to these people to hear someone say that they acknowledge their problems, those problems are real, and what’s more, those problems are not their fault. The absence of acknowledgement or inclusion of these problems in the Democratic talking points lends it some credibility, and there’s a robust media apparatus in place, with folks like Joe Rogan or Jordan Peterson, that allow them to form some sense of community and identity, while also moving them further on the way to being full-blown MAGA supporters.
It’s the same sort of strategic failure that the Dems encountered with working class people more broadly; they dismissed their concerns, told them everything was actually fine, when many acutely feel the struggle of existence, and didn’t offer a platform that got them excited and feeling like their economic concerns were being addressed. Then add in policy proposals that specifically target groups like black men, and many of them begin to view the entire field of politics as a zero-sum game, which one side is looking to rig against them.
Of course, this is a misguided take, at best, but it’s amplified by podcast bros and alt-right youtubers, and the way the DNC strategists takes the votes of these groups for granted lends further credence to the notion, in their eyes. The DNC desperately needs to come up with some countermeasures for the alt-right media bubble and stop assuming they can count on any votes as safe, especially if they don’t have heavy messaging targeting the demographics in question.
I really don’t see how Joe Rogan or Jordan Peterson are an issue. Literally all Jordan Peterson has said that you should take responsibility for your life and do better, that Joe Rogan sits down and has conversations with people taking a neutral perspective.
Harris had every opportunity to go on Joe Rogan, and she didn’t, which I think is possibly one of the main reasons that she lost the election. People are sick of corporatised media, bullshit. They want to hear people have actual conversations about real shit. That is something that the new wave media has become extraordinarily good at. And the left wing just can’t play that game because they’re too insincere and corporatised to have anything more than a 5 second sand bite.
I wouldn’t call it an alt right media bubble. I just think it’s individuals exercising their free speech, which has landed us in a situation where the traditional media, which is bought and paid for by big business, can no longer compete.
Trump didn’t win the election. The Democrats lost. And the data backs this entirely.
Peterson has said way more bullshit and its all on YouTube.
Rogan supposedly being neutral with everyone is problematic since it puts crazy people on equal footing with experts, and it causes confusion for people who may not know better. As an extreme example, being neutral means you should spend the time and effort to hear out a flat earther as much as an astronomer. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but not everyone is entitled to a platform to spew bullshit.
Whata the worste shit peterson has said?
What ur essentially saying is that people are too dumb to be allowed to decide if a flat earther or an astronomer should be listened to and that decision should be made for them? Who makes that decision joe? The government? You? The fucking stazi? Why not give the people the freedom to decide for themselves?
My biggest gripe is that science is really fucking hard and we’re unbelievably lucky to have made so many strides in knowledge and technology on the backs of generations of brilliant people lending their genius to the greater good. Flat-earth and other pseudo-sciences degrade the amount of pure brilliance, luck, and hard fucking work involved in getting to where we’ve gotten. I love the idea that some randos on the Internet could fundamentally turn science on it’s head, and perhaps it’s still possible. Science is much harder than most of these people even realize though.
Should we be skeptical of things in general–absolutely! Even if you truly believe you have a take that will change science at its core, you won’t be taken seriously by the scientific community if you can’t provide rock-solid proof that can be vetted and verified by other scientists. Is that unfair?
People are most certainly making their own choices – remember how hot ivermectin was for a minute there? Completely unsupported evidence of efficacy and guess what – it didn’t work. Personally, i think they should take science in their own hands and figure out why they’re wrong about so much. The problem here is what i think is a defining difference between a scientist and a pseudo-scientist: the scientist will pay attention to the results and will even change their hypothesis/theory when new evidence to the contrary is discovered. The pseudo-scientist already knows the answer they are looking for and will disregard any evidence to the contrary out of hand.
Remember the flat earther documentary where they set out to finally disprove modern science and failed spectacularly? Remember when confronted with hard evidence disproving their theory, they immediately started blaming the testing equipment and methodology, never yielding for a moment that they could be wrong. That is a problem, in my opinion. They regularly begin to reject real indisputable evidence in favor of ‘vibes’ or whatever leads them to believe hare-brained theories, and next thing you see people venturing further out into Lala Land where everything magically fits into their set of “theories” and they are further disconnected from reality.
I really think we’ve let down generation after generation with degrading educational standards. Pet theories are one thing but outright rejecting science because you can’t understand it or do it yourself is counterproductive. Pseudo science doesn’t help anyone and deserves to be relegated to the tabloids like they used to be (of course I’m sure that people believed some of that shit whole-heartedly back then too, again despite lacking any credible evidence)
As @TheAgeOfSuperboredom@lemmy.ca already pointed out, Rogan’s “I’m just promoting free-speech and practicing neutrality” platforms people who are wholly uninformed with equal standing as experts in a given field. For an example of how this is irresponsible, and yes, the average American really is too stupid to be trusted with distinguishing a square turd from a brownie, look at the rise of anti-vaccine sentiment and COVID denialism coming out of Joe “Just asking questions” over the years.
I wouldn’t call it an alt right media bubble. I just think it’s individuals exercising their free speech, which has landed us in a situation where the traditional media, which is bought and paid for by big business, can no longer compete.
It most certainly is an alt-right media bubble when those who get sucked into it refuse to even consider any evidence that doesn’t come directly from Joe Rogan, Fox, OANN or whatever other goofballs they watch. If you think these people and organizations are above the influence of big business, I’ve got several bridges to sell you.
This also isn’t strictly a matter of them not trusting news from other sources that don’t align with their own biases, but denying objective facts from experts in the field, all because Joe smoked DMT once, and what the experts say doesn’t feel right to him. See Rogan et al. as they promoted baseless COVID conspiracy theories while also disregarding any medical advice from public health experts, or the growing consensus amongst medical professionals and epidemiologists as we came to understand things better after a couple of years.
More like nagging at them.
While ignoring their concerns and blaming them for it.
The way I see it is, the youth were super excited about changing the shitty situation that faced them, and the prospect of having Berny Sanders as president, who also wants to change that situation, and they had that ripped away from them, so they were radicalised, they spend 4 years with a senile old man, who did nothings to change the staus quo, and so they voted naively for the candidate who proposed change.
Sounds like a fair assessment to me. You couldnt have bernie so u settled for trump lol.
Multiple reasons, but it starts with terrible education. They don’t know how to verify information at best, and at worst don’t want to, they believe they win when they piss off someone they don’t like. This means the information they get on current topics is generally something pushed by someone either paying an algorithm to target them or by things like AstroTurfing.
There’s a lot of value for the hegemony class in getting people to not care about the climate, endless war, genocide, and human rights in general.
And then you have the out of touch authoritarian liberals/neoliberals that control the liberal side of the mainstream media.
There was a reason they dipped deep into social media and podcasts, Dems didn’t understand this.
Less public / archived spaces as well. Videogame lobbies were rampant with Trump / MAGA messaging in 2019. Not sure what its like now as I quit all online gaming. Anyone 14-17 during that period who are now of voting age has likely gotten a massive dose of right wing propaganda.
That was Steve Bannons plan way back from 2015-16. He was the one to really push for indoctrinating the gamers and making gamer culture and maga anti-woke one in the same…
Now you can’t even go into a single steam discussions forum for a new popular game without seeing multiple “go woke go broke” and “is this game woke?” posts… Makes me sick…
Oh, but she went on The View! So, she’s all set.
…this was never a secret.
It sure was to the democratic party.
Because the dinosaurs that run it are idiots.
This was never a secret…
Secret republicans?
Everyone I know who listens to Joe Rogan is clearly Republican if they aren’t stating it themselves.
I’ve been listening to Rogan since 2017ish and he has totally shifted rightward. I used to listen to every episode because it was usually either funny or informative. Now it’s preachy and just captured by right wing talking points that border on conspiracy theories. My takeaway is that he listens to his comedian friends instead of his more educated guests, which is a microcosm of America. His show is only as good as the guest and subject matter… Neil DeGrasse Tyson? Fantastic. Trump? Problematic. It just comes across that since he is now in the running to be a billionaire with good investing strategy, he is now switching his interests and views to match. If you recognize a guest, definitely listen, but skip over everything else.
With dumbass hot takes like “You don’t need vitamins. You just need to concentrate about the pump.”
Gotta keep em busy somehow voting stupidly and paying wild interest rates on their lifted trucks or they might start thinking for themselves
I genuinely think Rogan is diluted to think those things rather than think big picture and make nefarious recommendations. On the other hand though he does hock neutropic supplements, so it’s just confusing to put a label on him. He’s legit uneducated and just parrots smart statements sometimes.
He was friends with Alex Jones for years. He got the entertainment side of him without the crazy dangerous conspiracy theories. Just the normal ones. I don’t hate Rogan. I just don’t find him funny or entertaining anymore. But I also haven’t listened to him in years. Maybe it’s worse now.
Didn’t Joe Rogan endorse Bernie Sanders at one point? The guy seems to be all over the map.
AFAIK he always claimed to be a centrist until a few days ago. I don’t think he exactly endorsed Bernie, but he’s said very nice things about him and his policies.
He endorses whoever likes him the most. He’s a moron. And so are his remaining fans.
Someone on Lemmy yesterday insisted that he was actually smart. When I asked for evidence, they mocked me for asking for evidence. That’s the level of intellect we’re talking about here.
Agreed, but, to be fair, what constitutes “smart” is not really objective. It can mean different things to different people and the evidence to back it up may not be acceptable evidence to those you debate.
I wasn’t the one insisting he was smart. It’s not really up to me to define it. They did not. They decided instead to mock the idea of asking for evidence for something.
Edit: Also, I provided links with quotes and a video to show what a fucking idiot he is.
Yeah, I went through a Rogan phase years ago back when he endorsed Bernie. He definitely was a little controversial even back then. I stopped listing as he got more controversial. I tuned back in briefly for the Trump and Rogan interview just out of curiosity. I was shocked to see how far Rogan has fallen.
For context, I’m a Gen Z man. I’m really disappointed the way my fellow Gen Z men are going.
I’ve gone on my own political journey being raised pretty conservative and becoming liberal as I met more diverse people. So honestly maybe Rogan should have always been a red flag, but I did look up to him for a while. I really wanted him to be a progressive voice, but it’s blatantly obvious now he is just as bad as the rest.
Yeah i gave the Trump and Musk one a listen in the interest of hearing what they are saying. Oof. Needs an independant real time fact checker. Bad.
There aren’t too many others getting much market share to voice other takes.
2 percent is not the wave they want it to be. Especially not with 10 million Democrats staying home.
Nah, that was already known
But Lemmy told me Gen Z was going to save us all this election.
But in the same breath they said that Democrats were right to ignore young people’s concerns because they don’t vote.
If they’re too insignificant to listen to, they’re too insignificant to blame.
I may slap the next person I hear say that. Fuck gen z soy boi beta cucks!
If only it was just Lemmy…I was being told by so many self-styled authorities that this generation had some kind of magical properties that no one that came before them has had, and just by virtue of “getting it” when it came to consuming things like social media (or something).
This is dumb. It’s always been dumb. The target demo is the target; they aren’t savvier than anyone else is that is a target. So when boomers were saying stupid shit about how Gen X “just gets it” when it comes to something like MTV, or the early days of the (privatized) 'net, that was just as stupid. MTV was a product and Gen X was the target demo, emphasis on target. The elitists quickly figured out a way to monetize the (privatized) 'net with some of the first target demo being boomers and Gen X.
It’s no different today. Without serious education in critical thinking, this stuff is only weaponized against the target demo, they don’t know shit about the new product any more than anyone else does.
Tbf Gen Z women showed up.
In other words: brainless morons let Rogan take a dump in their skull. It’s like the people that used to let Rush take a giant shit in their heads on the daily.
Remember how everyone was telling us how magical the next “generation” is? Yeah, I wasn’t really buying it, either. I fucking hate that Maher is right about this kind of thing, though.
Cmon, you gotta admit Tom Sawyer is a jam.
Maher is right about this…
Maher is an insufferable cunt who just hates all young people. Broken clock and all that… I couldn’t take listening to him even like 4+ years ago, I can’t imagine how much more annoying he’s gotten as he gets older.
I can’t believe he still has a show tbh I gotta wonder who tf is watching him
Other old people is probably a safe bet. If anything, his audience is probably hyped about how “Finally, somebody gets it and is talking about these damned young people!”
They underestimated the puppeteer who bought a social media for push hateful propaganda.
I think people also underestimate the amount of twitch streamers that are leaning right wing. Asmogold I think it the most popular one, but there are many others as well
Secret? What secret? Its been fucking obvious for the last 10 years!
I love how the picture is an attractive able bodied young white man with facial hair. I am so tired.
Lockdowns and distancing supposedly ended one of our flu strains but unfortunately stupidity never dies off.
Call them what they are : boys
