- cross-posted to:
- world@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- world@lemmy.world
Secretary of State Marco Rubio said on Monday that Ukraine would have to make concessions over land that Russia had taken since 2014 as part of any agreement to end the war.
Mr. Rubio spoke as he was flying to Jeddah, Saudi Arabia, for talks with senior Ukrainian officials, and 10 days after a contentious White House meeting between President Trump and his Ukrainian counterpart, Volodymyr Zelensky. The Trump administration halted military aid to Ukraine after the blowup, which centered on Mr. Trump’s refusal to include any security guarantees in a proposed deal involving Ukraine’s natural resources.
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I am completely honest, this is an open question, why do we care what his opinion is? Does he hold any real power in this?
Says the same guys who called Putin the victim while talking with Zelensky…
The US just decided that they’re not part of the negotiations anymore
*Putin says
It sounds like a new song from Putin’s addiction…
Rubio is a snowflake bitch. As bad as Americans are right now, we’re going to eat him in 2-3 years. Stay strong! Slava Ukraine!
Does this shithead hold his cards face out when he plays poker?
At the rate we’re going, I wouldn’t be surprised if trump drops all sanctions against Russia, and starts even funding them and providing them US weapons and Intel. I just wouldn’t be surprised.
I think he was already pushing for that not too long ago, but all the bad press lately has him backpedalling and promising Sanctions and Tariffs, but still won’t give back the foreign aid he took away.
I wonder what the useful idiot Elon Musk thinks about this, given he’s shown fealty to Putin several times already.
I would assume they’re getting the Intel already. The entire administration is comprised of Russian assets and useful idiots. Even if the info isn’t being handed to them directly, all the existing security is being ripped to shreds and the teams that would counter any threats have officially been told to ignore Russia completely.
That said, I wouldn’t put it past Trump to publicly give Intel to Russia, but only because he’s an idiot and assuming there is a low he won’t sink to his always a losing bet.
I wouldn’t be surprised if we’re already in a slow rollout for him to go public with support for Russia. The deal could be that Russia and US split Ukraine in some way, whether it stays as “Ukraine” with installed leadership or blatantly annexed.
The problem is the maga cult and the Republicans in congress who would support it. The maga masses will lap up whatever propaganda they’re fed like puppies and a bowl of peanut butter. But what the fuck are the Republican leadership thinking? At that point the US has fallen, but maybe it already has and we just don’t know yet. But maybe not… time will tell.
Trump wants russia blessing when the US invades Greenland.
Tulsi probably hitting Putin with “u up ;)”
I’d say it’s a given at this point.
Trump has offended pretty much all of our major trade partners, so we need a new market to sell US goods as well as replace our imports. As it just so happens, Russia desperately needs goods due to the sanctions and has a reduced manufacturing capacity as a result of marching all their young (and not so young) men into a meat grinder. And even though Putin is a backstabbing, murderous, KGB thug Trump knows that he won’t touch him, because Trump’s just too useful of a flunky.
Granted it’s a morally repugnant move, but when has that ever stopped Trump?
The only territory that Ukraine has to cede is Kursk
Came to make the same comment. There can be concessions on both sides.
They I think almost kicked out of there.
Unfortunately do the Trump holding back U.S. intelligence Russia mad huge gains in Kursk.
Okay. Us Europeans want to cede Florida.
Come on now, Rubio. You’re the one who opened up your big mouth.
Please take Florida.
The actual deterrent here being that Putin realizes he has to govern Florida and backs off Ukraine entirely.
No, it must not. If someone breaks into your house, is he allowed to keep the loot?
Not one inch.
Russia must be quite desperate to put that much pressure on them
Without security guarantees, this isn’t a “peace” deal, it’s a capitulation and an invitation for future aggression from Russia.
What about the security “guarantees” Ukraine already had?
I guess it’s only a guarantee if it’s guaranteed at least twice? Lol.
What guarantees are those? And why are you putting them between the quote marks?
He’s talking about the 1994 treaty Ukraine made with Russia in which Ukraine gave up its nuclear arsenal in exchange for Russia’s promise to never invade them.
He put “guarantees” in quotes because Russia fucking lied.
Because that’s what Russia does.
So what good do any kinds of guarantees from Russia or America or anyone else do for Ukraine in regards to this war when they already gave up a powerful means of self defense and were fucking lied to?
If guarantees don’t matter, why is Ukraine insisting to get them?
Right, but I meant guarantees like becoming member of NATO.
Imagine a hypothetical scenario in which Mexico invades the United States, takes complete control over the state of New Mexico, and right in the middle of the conflict Great Britain says “the war needs to end”, drafts a ceasefire proposal that allows them take control of half of the country’s natural resources, and offers no security guarantees in the event that Mexico decides to attack again. If you refuse, the British will stop sending military aid to help you continue fighting. Oh, and Mexico gets to keep New Mexico.
Who in their right fucking mind thinks that this is a good deal? Any sensible person would rather continue fighting than give up their advantage for some flimsy ceasefire that won’t stand up to an invader hellbent on conquest.
Lol. Remember when a bunch of assholes voted 3rd party or didn’t vote because they were upset with Democrat’s handling of foreign affairs?
Clown country.
I’d do it again, rather get expropriated and deported from this micky mouse country than use what little political input I have to endorse a genocide
I think the point here is that, rather than endorse a genocide, you endorsed 2 genocides, and everything else that this administration does. I get that even one genocide is too much, but for that one you could be calling your representative and writing letters and doing whatever else you can to people who might care about those actions.
What do you mean 2 genocides?
you could be calling your representative and writing letters and doing whatever else you can to people who might care about those actions.
my representatives are Democrats, they didn’t care
you endorsed 2 genocides
by lying about Bidens nonfunctioning brain Democrats created this situation. my vote had zero impact
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both stein and rfk got around 800+k votes. though i suspect many of them R voters on the fence.
Do you remember when the Biden Harris administration provided military, financial and diplomatic support for a genocide that lead to hundred of thousands of casualties? No wonder people didn’t want to vote for them.
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I’m sure if you go far enough back in time you could say that anyone in control of any particular swathe of land stole it from somebody else. Past wrongs committed are not a valid casus belli for modern wars of aggression or land grabs.
Regardless, your contrarianism doesn’t change the fact that Mexico surrendered that territory to us after the Mexican-American war. Legally, it belongs to the United States after the signing of the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, which redrew the border based on the path of the Rio Grande.
And that’s after Mexico violated a non-aggression pact and conquered Arizona.
That’s not a good example, the US does not rely on the UK to defend itself.
It’s a hypothetical scenario. I could think of some better examples if you really wanted, but that’s the most salient one I could think of off of the top of my head, because you know if the United States was attacked, we would expect the international community to fall behind our right to defend ourselves from any and all threats to our sovereignty.
I don’t see why things should be any different when considering Ukraine’s position.
The scenario just has nothing to do with the current situation in Ukraine. Of course Ukraine has the right to defend itself, nobody is saying otherwise.
Of course Ukraine has the right to defend itself, nobody is saying otherwise.
Article headline: “Ukraine Must Cede Territory in Any Peace Deal, Rubio Says”
Can’t exactly defend yourself when the people trying to broker peace on your behalf are forcing you to capitulate.
Nobody’s forcing Ukraine to sign a peace deal, they can keep fighting if they want.
To that point, lets be real, even the united states doesnt really care about new mexico. Crimea in this argument has actual economic value.
Honestly any square foot of what russia has stolen from Ukraine has so much more economic value in comparison to new mexico, its hardly a realistic comparison.
I get what you are saying. But taos vs a warm water sea port is such an insane comparison. Its so much worse. Albuquerque? Let em have it. Santa fe? Please.
Maybe the US could give New Mexico to Russia in place of Crimea.
You’re looking too far into the details. The value of the territory is irrelevant for this hypothetical scenario. But I’ve been catching a lot of flak in the comments for it, so you know what? I’ll humor you, let’s change the formula.
Let’s say tomorrow, Russia announces that because they feel that they were cheated in 1867, they are refusing to recognize the sale of the Alaska territory to the United States and are reestablishing their control over the land as it’s sole owner. They send an invasion force and they capture the land in a swift blitzkrieg-style assault, the United States is caught completely by surprise.
Now, the United States fights, but we can’t really conduct ground operations without the support of Canada. They are our not just our neighbors, but our staunchest allies in this fight. However, a new Prime Minister is sworn in and they suddenly decide to take a massive shift in foreign policy, and try to broker a “peace deal” between Russia and the USA in which we agree to sign over the rights to future drilling operations to Canada in exchange for a ceasefire from Russia, but Russia gets to keep Alaska since they occupy it now anyway. Refusal means Canada pulls their support, forbids US soldiers from operating in Canadian waters or on Canadian soil, and conducting operations in the occupied Alaskan territory becomes virtually impossible. And, let’s not forget, no security agreements even if we do sign the agreement. So, if Russia decides to attack Hawaii or California next, nobody will be compelled to aid us.
Is that a better comparison? Alaska has massive economic and strategic value, so there’s a good reason for Russia to want it. They’ve been regretting ever selling it to us in the first place.
I mean im an adult that can contextualize the geopolitical reasononing behind why this is a bad deal without relying on heavy handed amerocentric hypotheticals.
To be clear, I never disagreed with your point. I just think that your comparison was dumb. And honestly, using alaska is even worse.
I dont know why you need a comparison in the first place. You already have the actual event to look at. Its in eastern europe. And they are in a war.
I dont know why you need a comparison in the first place.
Evidently, there are a LOT of people who don’t seem to understand just why the deal was so bad to begin with. Not you, of course, but some other comments in these Ukraine threads are either woefully uninformed or intentionally being obtuse about acknowledging facts.
And sorry about it being a series of Amerocentric examples, especially here in World News where it’s probably a bit taboo or tone deaf, but suffice to say it seems like the primary culprit behind much the willful ignorance are Americans with a narrow understanding of foreign affairs. I’m also just sticking to what I know so I don’t embarrass myself with my terrible geography.
Of course the United States cares about Mexico. New Mexico’s GDP is about 15 times higher than Crimea’s.
they are ok with ceding Texas…
