- cross-posted to:
- android@lemdro.id
- cross-posted to:
- android@lemdro.id
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Can someone “redpilled by corporate” explain me how this policy actually increase security?
It’s trivial for a malware developer to pay $25 with a stolen card and a stolen id
Look at the “verified” bots on xitter, they didn’t solve the bots problem, rather just monetized it
It’s a lie. Google just wants control.
I would assume that you won’t just be able to register with a stolen id and stolen card.
Found the 91 Google employees
I wish I could tie whoever made this decision to a radiator and face judgement.
Calling it already, one of the most popular apps around will be a wrapper around ADB in order to install new apps - maybe Shizuku or Sui?
Hope they would be sued in America and Europe for it. I can’t believe it will be OK… And can’t believe they clearly think it will be.
I hope google fails as a whole in the near future and gets dissolved once and for all. Sick and tired of tech companies trying to be sources of authority, working with authoritarian governments, and dictating what you can and can’t do.
I’ll be honest, tech got us by the balls… and they know it.
No they don’t. There are viable, open source alternatives for 99% of the software/services we use. The fact that people are not aware of it is already like half of the real problem.
I don’t imagine that paradigm going away at all anytime soon or ever
I was about to switch to android but ended up with another iPhone because of Google killing the only reasons to use android.
I like my air but I’m still waiting for what I really want. A viable Linux phone.
Google is building a walled garden, so I went with this other walled garden instead.
You people have zero logical consistency and I’ve seen so many such comments on reddit. I want to pick your brain and figure out how you can roll over THAT easily for corpos.
Or maybe “if I have to be trapped in a walled garden, why would I pick Google’s shitty one?”
It’s still less walled though, and we’re in a topic that tells people that they can simply install apps via adb to get around this.
this seems to be going the shittitest direction it could…fuck Google
ps: loving the apple simps coming out to claim iPhones aren’t perfect just because you can’t “sideload” lool
loving the apple simps coming out to claim iPhones aren’t perfect just because you can’t “sideload” lool
Confused ape noises
fuck google for spyware google play services and severe integration of them into android thiugh ^^
i bailed on android to join my family on ios, and i hate it. now i cant even go back comfortably. so… linux phones?
I’m not sure why you did that. android still gives you more freedom and is still better
For now, yes. But time is running out and of course Apple is no solution. Only fools would go to apple now.
it would be nice
I miss my N900 every day.
The only advantage Android has over iOS is being able to install [any] software.
I was able to set custom APN settings on my Pixel to bypass the tethering block that MetroPCS puts on their cheapest plan.
There is nothing in iOS that lets you do that.
I also can’t run WiFi scanners on iOS.
And Android will still have ADB sideloading. On iOS I have to run shit like Sideloadly to re-sign applications every 7 days.
If you’re a true Android fan, there is still a lot to keep you on the platform.
Literally all of this is being able to run whatever software you want
So if Android loses that you go to the other place that also NOT lets you do that? That makes sense… Get a fairphone, install Ubuntu touch and stop rolling over like a good little dog.
Did I say I’d go to IOS? Did I say that at any point?
*had Fuck google and every piece of shit implementing this for them.
That’s one of the big ones. Also phones with SD card slots and headphone jacks.
Just about. There used to be more, but if im honest, if it works in iOS then its a decent experience most of the time.
But my custom apps makes or breaks my phone. Its so convenient.
Ill probably get a uconsole or something. Or keep my current phone til all this blows over.
iOS is infinitely more polished than Android. It’s rather stable and at least the main notification system isn’t that bad for privacy.
Edit: I want to inquire: what exactly is wrong about my comments. Android is a piece of shit. iOS is a piece of shit. iOS is smoother because Apple can engineer the parts more smoothly. Android lets you run software. I hate them both but I need to run Termux.
It is risky to say anything positive about Apple here, true or not.
Its not really a positive thing. More like bad and worse.
I agree. But you phrased it positively, and for that you must pay with digital schmeckles.
Aw :( now I won’t be able to buy some big fake boobiez.
Really depends which spin of Android you have. I have a Nothing Phone 2 and the OS is arguably more polished than on my SO’s iPhone 14, which frequently has bugs, lag, and crashes. You can’t really generalise about Android when there are so many versions of it.
That being said I’ll probably be looking into Linux phones in the next few years because I’m tired of corporations trying to control my devices.
Well I’m using graphene and it’s so laggy and can’t keep more than one app open at a time, so.
What phone, you must be running one of the first ones they made graphene for
Also running GrapheneOS (on an older phone) and this is not something I’ve ever experienced, nor seen as an issue in the forums.
I wasn’t denying the fact that you’re experiencing this issue, but since this is the first I’ve heard of something this bad in my 3 years of using GrapheneOS, this does appear to be a fairly unique case.
Provided you are using an otherwise well-functioning and currently supported device (and not an emulator), and that you are using a stable release installed via an official method (and there were no install issues), your best bet would be to ask for help in one of the community chats or forums: https://grapheneos.org/contact#community
You will be asked to share which device you are using though, which you did not seem comfortable doing in the post you linked to.
Unrelated, but I learned about the Android “task manager” (Running Services) from that post of yours, so thanks for sharing that.
Yeah GrapheneOS is open source bro. Probably doesn’t have full compatibility with your phone if I had to guess. That’s really not a like-for-like comparison to iOS.
Grapheme is smooth as can be for me and great for multitasking
“It works on my machine”
The fact of the matter is that Android is hacked on top of Linux and there’s endless problems because of it. One part is that there’s no task manager and system apps eat up well over half my memory which means that once I open one app, the other needs to be immediately evicted from RAM
Its terrible for security haha. We were able to 0 day it a couple of times without trying all that hard. So many CVEs that are repeatable. I wil admit the UI is phenominally better (in my opinion). And the official apps (as long as you dont want to do something specific) are perfect at what they do.
Android is a bit better but you can exploit it because people dont update their phones. Google is actually VERY good at keep those up to date…but if no one updates, its kinda a wash.
Again my opinion, im not too attached to either. They both suck in their own unique ways. #1 is you have to use their tool sets which is unique instead of any other computer system. Its such a hassle to keep up with as a software developer.
I was just talking about the notification system which doesn’t require something that uploads your location to Google 24/7
ah ok. Well im not familiar with that other than push notifications, which you can set up outside of googles ecosystem…although everyone likes using firebase for some reason.
IIRC notifications can only be delivered reliably via Firebase — anything else gets paused if the phone is in Doze etc.
Yes that’s why I said “main notification system”
ok.
So I guess I’m going to have to learn to use ADB.
I believe side loaders for the meta quest already use it under the hood. maybe there’s potential to make a side loading app store
Easy but annoying.
Install with options bout to be my new best friend
Do tell? I couldn’t find that app in the Play Store
Google can go fuck itself.
Hopefully this will put some jet fuel into the Linux phone development.
Yeah, I’ll switch to absolutely anything that allows open installation of third party apps.
Google can go fuck itself.
Google would much rather go fuck you.
they need thier AI to profit somehow, mining all your data to offeset the cost of those data centers.
I’m checking out Graphene OS next week and pretty pumped about it. This Google ratfucking has been just the push I need to get off Android.
And obviously I haven’t stopped telling people around me haha
Most F-Droid users are NOT custom ROMs.
This means that as long as F-Droid does not get their own developer key - it will become useless. F-Droid is privacy focused - both dev and user, and they oppose requiring devs to essentially give up their privacy and sign the APK with their own dev key.Now, if F-Droid is dead, GrapheneOS becomes useless. Who would want to develop apps for the 0.0001% of the population (i.e custom ROM users)
This.
I am the person you are talking about. I’ve looked into graphene before and I do host some of my own services at home. I also work full time and I don’t want to spend all of my free time managing things. I use F-Droid, but I am on stock android on my pixel.
I appreciate the privacy and FOSS nature of F-Droid, but I use things like Android auto Google maps for work, I use banking apps on my phone as well. I know technically micro G and blah blah blah, but like I said: work full time.
Graphene is bult on top of android AOSP, which is owned by google… And of course they are fucking it over.
Check calyxos.org s recent blog posts, it is basically dying (and graphene is the same)
What happened to the Open Handset Alliance?
The pause in Calyx updates has nothing to do with Google’s fuckery, and they are not “dying.” They lost a major lead developer and decided they needed to restructure so no one would be so essential going forward.
So… huh, so what’s the alternative then? I guess some other flavour of linux?
For mobile phones that works as a daily driver? Gobbling up iOS. Or gobbling up what’s becoming of Android.
I really wish we had open phones that “just work”. I’d even go with slightly quirky but functional. Unfortunately, that requires strong cooperation between hardware maker and software developers; and it will require a lot of work. But that’s not the main issue. The direction we’re headed toward is “everything need an official app”, and those will mostly only work on “official” phones made by big manufacturers.
Even today, making some bank apps work on non vanilla Android is not always straightforward, and it’s still relatively open and easy to do. The move by Google is going to tighten this even more, and I have no doubt, if they pull through, that this will go in the requirements for the “play protect” validation BS. Meaning if you want that bank app, or whatever state digital ID app (meh) to work, you’ll need a “real” Android or an iOS device. And those apps are becoming more and more mandatory (I can’t log-in to my bank’s online website without their app and proprietary 2FA…).
A niche, open-source OS, Linux or modified AOSP or whatever, will have a hard time filling that gap as things keep moving. Which is really sad.
You are of course aware that Graphene OS is affected just like any other version of Android?
I don’t see why it would need to be affected.
The constraint to require a valid signing isn’t something imposed by the license on the Android code. If you want to distribute a version of Android that doesn’t check for a registered signature, that should work fine.
I mean, the Graphene guys could impose that constraint. But they don’t have to do so.
I think that there’s a larger issue of practicality, though. Stuff like F-Droid works in part because you don’t need to install an alternative firmware on your phone — it’s not hard to install an alternate app store with the stock firmware. If suddenly using a package from a developer that isn’t registered with Google requires installing an alternate firmware, that’s going to severely limit the potential userbase for that package.
Even if you can handle installing the alternate firmware, a lot of developers probably just aren’t going to bother trying to develop software without being registered.
F-Droid works […]
[…]
[…] that’s going to severely limit the potential userbase for that package.
I don’t think most developers who are putting their Open-Source apps on F-Droid have any minimum user threshold.
But if Graphene chooses not to do this, they diverge from the Android project. Which will take more time to maintain the project which will ultimately lead to more developers burning out and dropping out of the project.
It doesn’t need to be affected, but most open source projects don’t have the resources to keep going against big companies when most of their users aren’t contributing.
They already diverge by having a network permission and a bunch of other differences, and not being allowed to use Google Pay because of those differences
That might be true, I don’t know much about GrapheneOS. But I do know that users of open source projects expecting changes to come out of thin air, and filing bugs when they don’t, is hurting the volunteers behind open source projects. So we should all make sure to volunteer some of our own time or money to keep the projects we love going, instead of just expecting them to fix the things we dislike.
The aosp has been in the process of being gutted, I surmise in preparation of these anti consumer measures, graphene os has its work cut out for it. I imagine that after the dust settles, consumers will have to pick between an immature Linux os or their personal preference of walled garden.
Graphene could sandbox the integrity check, just like they do with the Play Store.
I would guess that it’s probably not much by way of change — theoretically, maybe just a single line patch — to cause this check not to take place.
Theoretically it might be, but it’s another patch you’ll have to maintain
What?? I was not. I thought it was compatible, or like a fork idk… Guess I’ve got some reading to do.
Get off Android to … Android 🤪
Thankfully I have root, I’ll just simply hook into it runtime via Xposed to bypass this nonsense.
Seriously anyone who doesn’t have root on their Android devices these days and age, well may Google have mercy on you lol
I used to root every phone, but by 2025 I’ve given up. Hard to unlock bootloaders, random apps (especially banking) thinking you will get hacked and stops working, the entire community around rooting and mods is like 10% of what it used to me, hardly any modern phone still gets custom roms, etc… Recently saw some statistic about custom roms - on average, around 50 phones 5-8 years ago had support for custom roms. By 2025, that number has fallen to 4.
Android is not what it used to be
You said it like banking apps will be happy to work with a Linux phone lol, the banks always have their interests inherently conflict with user control anyway. And rooting and getting a custom ROM (one which exists or otherwise) are two completely different things that have nothing to do with each other, and you shouldn’t support manufecturers who choose to make it difficult to unlock bootloader anyway.
By 2025, rooting still empowers you to make your own Android device however you like it to be.
Also not many people care about custom ROM these days because Android stock ROM got much better in average, so there’s much less a need for creating a brand new ROM just to get basic features. Why making a brand new ROM instead of modding the pretty good one you already have now. And root empowered ROM modding tools that are developed as Magisk module or Xposed modules still have a pretty big community, there’s a long list of pretty big repos with hundreds of modules each, and with how sophisticated Magisk and Lsposed have evolved it’s easier than ever to write your own mods
Don’t say that on XDA. Half the people there will say you don’t actually need root to do what you want and the other half will demand you justify why you specifically need root before they even entertain the idea that having full privileges on your own fucking hardware is a valid desire.
XDA is dead, and you just described one of the symptoms of a forum being dead.
That said there are still a small amount of people posting detailed posts for rooting Xperia phones, for how to flash OS updates with unlocked bootloader without losing your user data, for how to bypass carrier restrictions to get international model to work with the 5G bands in the US via build.conf edit and baseband flashing, etc. There are perks of a community being small and niche, and I guess not everyone is brained washed by Samsung’s propaganda they use to justify permanently locked bootloader on their phones lol
Are you certain you’ll be able to do this? Do you have more info?
Recent AOSP repo added lines of code to Package Installer to handle enforcing restricting whether Package Installer installs an APK file or not based on dev signatures, as well as denying installation if internet isn’t available so it can’t contact Google’s servers for dev signature verification.
So this is enforced by Package Installer, which is already how Google enforces their ridiculous minimal SDK version requirement for installing APK packages, as well as for blocking app update with an APK package with mismatched signature or blocking downgrading an existing app with an APK package, which I already have bypassed via Xposed this way.
Besides, rooting gives YOU total control over your own device like when you have sudo on Linux, even if Google tries some new BS there will be a way to counter it when you have root
