Crystal Hefner and the nonprofit controlling Hefner's documents are in a dispute over the materials, which feature intimate images of women. She says the docs "may include images of girls who were underage at the time."
Please use the term CSAM. Secondly, if they can’t identify the people in the photos, the ages may be difficult to determine. That could legally be an area which might make enforcement of a law hard. I don’t know how these laws work, just throwing the idea out there. If I am wrong, someone please correct me. The article specifically mention California and Illinois.
Because someone made up the idea that porn must be consensual so they could quibble over terminology instead of doing anything about child sexual abuse.
“Revenge Porn” is a more commonly-used term these days than is CSAM, and the whole point of it is that it’s non-consensual (though the original act may have been, the recording may, and the distribution by definition is not)
It’s not about consent. Porn in its usual context is sexual media people use to get off. With CSAM the main subject is children getting abused, the fact that pedophiles use it to get off is a secondary consideration.
The victim should take precedence in nomenclature.
Porn isn’t something with a victim, it’s something a person gets off to. Sexual abuse material is a picture with an abuse victim whether or not someone is getting off to it, because that’s not the part that matters. It’s not porn because the fact someone gets off to this picture isn’t the important thing about it.
That’s like if you called someone a cannibal was eating “human meat” … Like no, meat is meant to be eaten as food, this is the “murdered remains of a person”.
I don’t even know if you’re being serious at this point. The distinction should be pretty clear.
The distinction you are trying to make is clear, it’s just not an actual current distinction in the English language.
You are inventing a part of the definition of pornography which says, “it does not have a victim” or alternatively, “the important thing about it is that someone gets off to it.” You won’t find that in any dictionary definition of porn, and the continued use of the term “child porn” shows that this is not how people use the word in practice.
So it’s not that you’re merely relating facts about terms. The only explanation is that this is a distinction you feel people ought to make. But compare it to other things:
Revenge porn - another term where we use “porn” but where there is a victim.
Drink driving - the word “drink” turns a term like “driving” which is not immoral or illegal, into something different. The focus is on the activity, not the victim.
Theft - the focus is on the property stolen, not on the victim, its owner.
You aren’t going to convince anyone who doesn’t think that child porn is that bad that is actually is, by instead insisting everyone call it CSAM. It’s not the name that makes them think it’s OK.
I believe the idea is that porn is consensual and a child cannot possibly consent. Because of this, the term child porn isn’t strong enough or an accurate description for the crime they have fallen victim to.
On the other hand, child sexual abuse material, and especially the shortened CSAM, feels very sterile as a term. I think “child porn” is by far a stronger term that evokes a more visceral reaction in the average person than CSAM.
Not as gross as “child porn”, or “kiddie porn”, I feel gross just typing that out. CSAM just feels more clinical, more detached, like a term a defense attorney would insist upon to avoid biasing the jury.
Child porn. Kiddie porn. Child sexual abuse material. It’s all the same thing.
Being in porn ≠ consent. There is a shitload of porn out there that is absolutely non-consensual, and I wouldn’t be surprised if even a quarter of existing porn was consensual. Revenge porn is one specific non-consensual category, but porn producers often use manipulation tactics to groom young women into the industry, then dump them when they’re no longer “pretty” or whatever terms those shitheaps use.
Please use the term CSAM. Secondly, if they can’t identify the people in the photos, the ages may be difficult to determine. That could legally be an area which might make enforcement of a law hard. I don’t know how these laws work, just throwing the idea out there. If I am wrong, someone please correct me. The article specifically mention California and Illinois.
why do you prefer csam over the other term?
Because someone made up the idea that porn must be consensual so they could quibble over terminology instead of doing anything about child sexual abuse.
Right? There’s plenty of porn out there that’s unconsensual. Calling it the acronym obscures it more because no one knows wtf it means.
And that’s probably their real motivation for trying to force the acronym on us.
“Revenge Porn” is a more commonly-used term these days than is CSAM, and the whole point of it is that it’s non-consensual (though the original act may have been, the recording may, and the distribution by definition is not)
Do you know what the term “revenge porn” means? lmao. What country are you from?
…are you implying anything they said is wrong? What country are you from?
I’m from Writeaworthwhilecommentistan
Ahhh, you’re from North Asia then. Got it.
I think you missed an “a” when reading my comment and think I’m saying revenge porn is a term for CSAM. If so, reread it.
It’s not about consent. Porn in its usual context is sexual media people use to get off. With CSAM the main subject is children getting abused, the fact that pedophiles use it to get off is a secondary consideration.
The victim should take precedence in nomenclature.
So “child porn” which makes it clear the victim is the child should be fine?
Porn isn’t something with a victim, it’s something a person gets off to. Sexual abuse material is a picture with an abuse victim whether or not someone is getting off to it, because that’s not the part that matters. It’s not porn because the fact someone gets off to this picture isn’t the important thing about it.
That’s like if you called someone a cannibal was eating “human meat” … Like no, meat is meant to be eaten as food, this is the “murdered remains of a person”.
I don’t even know if you’re being serious at this point. The distinction should be pretty clear.
The distinction you are trying to make is clear, it’s just not an actual current distinction in the English language.
You are inventing a part of the definition of pornography which says, “it does not have a victim” or alternatively, “the important thing about it is that someone gets off to it.” You won’t find that in any dictionary definition of porn, and the continued use of the term “child porn” shows that this is not how people use the word in practice.
So it’s not that you’re merely relating facts about terms. The only explanation is that this is a distinction you feel people ought to make. But compare it to other things:
You aren’t going to convince anyone who doesn’t think that child porn is that bad that is actually is, by instead insisting everyone call it CSAM. It’s not the name that makes them think it’s OK.
Everything you’re saying is idiotically pedantic over distinctions that don’t exist in reality.
When activists aren’t.
I believe the idea is that porn is consensual and a child cannot possibly consent. Because of this, the term child porn isn’t strong enough or an accurate description for the crime they have fallen victim to.
On the other hand, child sexual abuse material, and especially the shortened CSAM, feels very sterile as a term. I think “child porn” is by far a stronger term that evokes a more visceral reaction in the average person than CSAM.
Maybe as an acronym, but when you say the full phrase out loud it still feels pretty damn gross
Not as gross as “child porn”, or “kiddie porn”, I feel gross just typing that out. CSAM just feels more clinical, more detached, like a term a defense attorney would insist upon to avoid biasing the jury.
Calling it porn implies that a person can consent. A minor cannot consent.
Child porn. Kiddie porn. Child sexual abuse material. It’s all the same thing.
Being in porn ≠ consent. There is a shitload of porn out there that is absolutely non-consensual, and I wouldn’t be surprised if even a quarter of existing porn was consensual. Revenge porn is one specific non-consensual category, but porn producers often use manipulation tactics to groom young women into the industry, then dump them when they’re no longer “pretty” or whatever terms those shitheaps use.