I need a new car, and I really want to go full electric. I’m wondering if anyone regrets buying one? What are the downsides?
Make sure that the car matches your expectations.
Don’t trust their range claims, most of the time they are exaggerated and only able to get that range on a perfect day doing constant 45mph without hills.
Do you have a reliable place to charge it? If you don’t have a personal parking place, and cannot install a charger at said place, trusting you have the range you need gets difficult, and expensive. As you have to rely on public chargers that are not very reliable, and worse for battery longevity (level 3 chargers)
Speaking of range. What range do you actually NEED? My opinion is the minimum range should be double the normal daily commute, as most level 2 chargers can add ~18 miles/he charging (overnight charge means 144 miles charge). Double your commute gives you a buffer for the heater, or the grocery run after work. For most people this is only 80 miles… which almost every electric only car can do without issues.
Is the cost worth the vehicle? Buying new is expensive, buying used can be risky. Do your research thoroughly and you’ll be able to decide what fits what you NEED (and that answer may easily be a used ICE vehicle instead)
I’ve had a full electric vehicle for 5+ years now as my daily. But I have always had a personal parking place, with a level 2 charger. I consider electric only to be a commuter car at best. It’s not going to be able to do a road trip. And depending on the car and the commute may even not be able to do a grocery run after work some days. If you have another car that is ICE that you can keep for those times, cool. Or if you are ok with planning, and rent a car when you want to do a road trip, great.
Personally I suggest a plug in hybrid for anyone who can only have one car, and is considering going electric. Prius prime, Chevy volt, Chrysler Pacifica are the ones that have enough range for a short commute, the rest are trying but just haven’t gotten there yet.
I consider electric only to be a commuter car at best. It’s not going to be able to do a road trip. And depending on the car and the commute may even not be able to do a grocery run after work some days.
I really wonder what kind of car you drive. Sounds like a Nissan Leaf or something.
I’ll share a couple of anecdotes regarding my experience with EVs:
My parents live on a farm in rural Maine. They are on their second Chevy Bolt (first was a lease, and they liked it so much that they upgraded to a later generation when the lease expired). It’s an inexpensive, no-frills EV that is their primary means of transportation. Living in the country, the shortest trip they take is likely to be at least 20 miles round-trip. In the past, I’ve borrowed that car for an overnight trip to Vermont. We made sure to charge it at home before the leaving, and drove to Vermont without needing to stop. I don’t recall the exact distance, but it was about 4 hours of driving through rolling hills. We charged it again in Vermont, and drove home the next day.
My partner and I have a 2023 Hyundai Ioniq 5 that we bought used for $28k. It’s all-wheel drive and has a battery warmer, both of which are helpful in cold climates. We do not have a charger at home. My wife’s commute is 20 miles round trip, and we are able to charge the car where she works, which we do roughly once a week. Although the car itself is capable of charging very quickly, the charger available to us is a low-power home charger, so it’s nice to be able to leave it plugged in during the full work day. We don’t hesitate to take this car on longer trips, especially if they take the interstate highway system or pass through major cities, where faster charging is always available.
When I bought the car, it was 150 miles away from my house. It was charged to 100% when I picked it up, and the car estimated 300 miles of range. We arrived at home with 50% charge remaining, so I’d say the 300 mile range was pretty accurate.
With this car and our charging habits, daily driving doesn’t really require any special thought or planning at all. For longer trips, anything less than a 150 mile round trip requires no more planning than “I should make sure to charge it within a day or so of the trip, if possible.” For a trip in the 250 mile range, I would definitely prefer to start fully charged, if possible, otherwise I’d want to explore charging options along the way. Only if going over that would I definitely feel the need to investigate charging options at my destination or along the route. A home charger would make things even simpler, but as it is it’s so low-stress that we don’t feel a lot of urgency to get one installed.
I recommend reading Tim Bray’s experiences with several years of EV-only ownership, including some long (1000+ mile) road trips in Canada. Here are a couple:
I live in the western us, where 150 miles isn’t all that far, and 200 between compatible fast chargers can be normal depending on where you’re driving.
In the end it’s all about everyone’s personal situation. Mine is, that battery is only a commuter because there’s no way I can afford the 400+ mile cars (nor am I interested in them anyways)
Yep, I live in the south and we will regularly (several times a year) drive 300 miles or more to visit the various families.
If you’re pushing for the lowest range, lowest cost EV that covers your daily needs, it will be a commuter-only car.
This wall of text is like an EV prophylactic
Is the cost worth the vehicle? Buying new is expensive, buying used can be risky. Do your research thoroughly and you’ll be able to decide what fits what you NEED (and that answer may easily be a used ICE vehicle instead)
This is one of the rare cases where, at least for right now, leasing a new vehicle may make more sense financially than purchasing outright. For one thing, many more cars are eligible for the $7500 federal tax rebate when leased instead of purchased. For another, used electric vehicles seem to lose their value a lot more than ICE vehicles. This is a combination of newer, better cars being released at lower prices than previous vehicles and consumers being unsure of the capacities of older battery packs. The latter is seeming to be less of an issue than feared based on preliminary data, but we really only have long-term results for a few models. The former is much more volatile from the market, though. Elon Musk single-handedly tanked used car values when he dropped prices on model 3 and Y vehicles, and it happens every time they cut prices, but Tesla is not the only electric manufacturer that’s been cutting prices on new cars. While manufacturers would love to sell for high prices, the reality is they need a larger market to be profitable from economies of scale, so as they reduce costs there’s been a general trend to cut prices too, either by cutting prices on existing models or introducing new, less-expensive models.
All of that is to say, it looks like the leasing companies aren’t factoring in enough depreciation on current leases. A lease is essentially you paying for the depreciation of the car. If you’re paying for a $50,000 car to be worth $35,00 in two years but it actually ends up being worth $25,000 in that time you’ve come out ahead, especially compared to if you bought it and tried to sell it yourself.
I’ve found that buying used is fine if the car is still under the manufacturers original warranty. Better yet if it has the premium/extended warranty package.
That’s basically the only warranty that you would care about (and actually want to extend), most other warranties have so many exclusions that they’re not worth it. And definitely ignore anyone calling you telling you that they’ve “been trying to reach you about your cars extended warranty.”
I’ve found the range is better than what they claim for stop and go city driving due to regen braking. But otherwise the range estimate is about as accurate as the miles per gallon estimate on a gas car.
It is definitely way cheaper to own than a gas car.
Teslas are exaggerated, the rest of the market is dead on for range estimates. EVs are great for road trips, you have to stop for bathroom breaks anyway. L1 chargers at home are fine and L2 chargers get you through every day perfectly fine. You only really need L3 for road trips.
Mine is not a Tesla, and its range is exaggerated… Or at least its range has a hidden asterisk that would read “under ideal conditions with a gentle driving style.” It self-adjusts based on my recent driving history, and I mostly don’t let the battery get low enough that I have to care about how precise it is… But it definitely skews heavily optimistic, especially when I first bought the car. It’s roughly the same in that regard as a Tesla is, according to the Tesla drivers I know.
as most level 2 chargers can add ~18 miles/he charging (overnight charge means 144 miles charge).
Level 2 EVSEs (the charger is actually in the car) have a wide cross-section of power delivery. Portable units are usually limited to ~20 amps and will do this level of charge. Installed units with a sufficient circuit can charge at a rate 40 - 60 miles / hour. They are also considerably more expensive and should be installed by an electrician (adding more cost).
For the record, Level 1 EVSE’s (that plug into a US 110v outlet) only do 3 - 5 miles/hour. Important to know for US renters who might not be able to get a 220v circuit to their parking spot.
Double your commute gives you a buffer for the heater, or the grocery run after work. For most people this is only 80 miles… which almost every electric only car can do without issues.
Is the cost worth the vehicle?
This is where I get grumpy. I feel like that kind of range is a different category of vehicle, and it should be significantly cheaper than an ICEV, since it means I need to plan around the range.
I realize it’s the size of the battery pack, so it isn’t where most of the cost of the vehicle comes from, but still.
When it’s time to replace my current vehicle, I’ll probably go PHEV. But ideally public transit will be solved, so I won’t need to. 🤣
If you buy a PHEV be prepared for the cost of a gas car and an EV combined
That kind of range is a different vehicle. My 500e I bought for 7k. It’s the perfect commuter.
Do you really NEED to be able to drive 300 miles every day? If so, battery isn’t likely for you. And if you don’t need to, why cry that it can’t?
if you don’t need to, why cry that it can’t?
Because I need to drive 300 miles every few months and a car I own that can do that is cheaper than a car that can’t and renting something that can for the few times I need it. Rental cars are expensive and most come with per mile charges on top of the daily rate.
It takes less than twenty minutes to charge enough to make that in any modern ev. Unless you’re filling up on gas before your trips anyway, you’re still gonna have to stop. The difference in time is negligible.
Gas cars fill even faster. Many EVs don’t charge at high speeds, and not all chargers support high speeds even if the car can. Evs do have the advantage of being fully charged before you leave, so trips that can be done on one charge never need to stop. However longer trips have issues.
Don’t forget that EV chargers are not nearly as common as gasoline. It is rare that someone needs to plan gas stops on a trip, when the gauge gets down to 1/4 you stop at the next town is the rule most people use (there is variation, those who use 1/8 as the rule sometimes run out of gas, some use 1/2). For EV trips you still have to plan your charging stops, particularly if you are getting off the well traveled path - you can still make most trips but you better how the chargers are working when you get there
Not only that, as EVS get more popular those stations will get more saturated. Even with more stations that means longer waits. Imagine a line for gas where it takes 5 total minutes to fill, if that. Now imagine that line with 20+ minute EV charging, per vehicle.
Im not against EVS but there are drawbacks. Acting like there aren’t isn’t doing Anyone any good.
Quite frankly I wish they’d just spend money on public transit.
One thing to keep in mind is that you don’t need the infrastructure of a gas station to have an EV charging station. My wife borrowed my car the other day and topped up at an apartment block. Only one place I went to could be charitably called a gas station, the rest were car dealerships and malls. But I’m also fortunate enough to be able to use an L1 charger at home and work so I tend not to use any.
Not even 20 minutes. If you are doing 300 miles, you probably only need to sit on the charger for maybe an extra 100 miles of charge. That is maybe 5-10 minutes.
Or if you get something like the Equinox EV, you may not have to charge during that trip at all.
My 500e I bought for 7k
A vehicle that can do a daily commute for 7k would be perfect. If you’re talking about the Fiat 500e, it’s 34k in my region. The cheapest used I can see is 22k.
Do you really NEED to be able to drive 300 miles every day? If so, battery isn’t likely for you. And if you don’t need to, why cry that it can’t?
This comes across as hostile.
My complaint is price points. When I get reduced range, I feel like I should pay less. An EV with a range of 120km in the winter for 7k would be amazing. It’d be a decent deal up until 15k. After that, the apparent value drops off. Like I said in my post, a PHEV feels like better value.
Yup I agree for most people the phev is much more logical. Though the complexity comes with lessened reliability and more costly repairs.
I also agree that the low mile capable ev are a bit over priced. I bought the 500e with 20k miles. It has 65k now and I could probably sell it for the same 7k I bought it for.
Spot on. Another thing to consider is weather. EVs perform worse in cold weather - lower ranger and slower charging. Some manufacturers are worse than others. Preconditioning while plugged in is super helpful in below freezing temperatures and use the heated seats and heated steering wheel instead of climate control if you can.
Just needs some research if you live somewhere where below freezing temperatures occur at times in a year. Absolutely not a reason to avoid EVs altogether, just know the limitations, what to expect, and how to best mitigate some of the limitations.
worse for battery longevity (level 3 chargers)
Is this because the power on fast charges is too high and bad for batteries in the long run?
Battery temperature management seems to be a key limiting factor.
At least a few years ago, and likely still, the reasons and conditions under which the barrier layers in the battery degrade were not super well understood. Heat seems to be a key contributing factor and charging a battery quickly warms up the battery and I suppose not fully evenly within a cell. Not knowing the complete extent of this makes the early LEAF’s lack of actively cooled battery a reasonable choice. Before that, the batteries of earliest Prius cars held up way longer than expected.
Like with a phone: heat and cold is not super awesome for the battery. It seems heat is especially bad for longevity.
Not "too high"technically. But does put more load on the battery, causing more dendritic growth in the cells.
Its not to high or bad for them, it’s more like it just pushes the system to its max over and over. They are designed for fast charging.
Its like stretching a rubber band that can go to 3ft over and over. Its part of its design, but it will cause more wear and tear then just stretching it a few inches.
You’re saying it’s not too high or bad for them then you say it will cause more wear and tear. Which do you mean?
It’s within specification, but it isn’t optimal.
I went from an 08’ VW Rabbit to a '21 VW id.4 a few months ago. Got the $4k tax rebate passed onto the dealer to bring my price down to $19k [~$21k after taxes/fees], it’s the AWD Pro S, and doesn’t have the Gradient Package [some silvery exterior bits and slightly larger wheels]. I love the car, my family loves the car. The only nitpick I reaaaaaally have and that most people have for the VW evs is the damn driver side window switches lol. You get 2 and have to tap a touch sensitive bit to switch it to the back. Makes no sense. The steering wheel touch inputs for cruise control and media are another controversial choice, but I’ve gotten used to it.
As far as an EV in general goes. Like most have said, check out the charging network you have where you are and where you plan to be. I’ve only done one road trip in my id.4 [from buying it in Chicagoland and bringing it home] and while the range was “OK” [about 150 highway miles per charge], since I was along a string of L3s along the turnpike, I wasn’t worried about making it to a charger. My immediate area had a couple of L3s, but now there’s probably about double/triple around me now that’s opened in the few months I’ve had my car.
That being said, my circumstance have the car as mostly a commuter, so I tend to last on a charge all week, and then L1 charge it Sun-Tues morning to start all over. Any around town stuff during charging time doesn’t really make a dent since it’s all within a few miles of my home. I also am able to charge at work for free, though sometimes spots get filled. Initially I was thinking about getting a L2 EVSE, but between home and work, I don’t really feel the need for one. I’d also need one with a good 50’ cord since I park in front of my house, otherwise wife and I would have to re-arrange the cars whenever I wanted to charge.
That being said, if stuff happens and we do go up to my sisters about 40 miles away or something happens to where I do need to charge at a L3, the price per “tank” has been about $15 and taken 20-ish minutes. Most of the time I’m watching a few youtube videos, or going in for a restroom break and by the time i get back the car’s about ready.
My car, and I think most EVs nowadays will have a setting limiting the charge to 80% to help with keeping the battery healthy. If I’m not using air conditioning at 80% my estimated range is about 190-200 miles, if it’s hot and I’m using AC, it’ll go down to 185ish. First upcoming winter, so I’ll get to see how much my car is impacted. I don’t usually worry about range. I did at first because I had a couple of close calls about charging stations not being available while doing some longish trips back and forth, but I think in general my immediate and surrounding areas that I might frequent have gotten more stations recently.
OH. Insurance for me wasn’t much more than what I was already paying, but registration in my state tacks on another $200 dollars a year, presumably since having an EV you’re not paying into the gas tax. Some states don’t have EV fees, some do. So might want to check that. My co-worker just found out about that and wasn’t happy lol.
I would get a hybrid, but I have nowhere to charge an electric car. I live in an apartment, and unless you’re rich you can’t afford an apartment with charging stations. I’ve never even seen one, personally.
Do the numbers! Check that the range is at least double of that you need. Check if the purchase price makes economic sense. Put priority on wants and needs. Think of resale value, because you never know if some life changing event can happen.
I avoided that bullet in 2017 when my e39 blew the headgasket. It was either a modern EV or hybrid or a cheap second hand gas guzzler. At less than 5000km a year the numbers told me what I needed to know, and looking back, my Mondeo ST220 has been much cheaper overall, fun and dead reliable.
I’ve been wanting a plug-in hybrid, where you’re fully electric under ~40mi of daily travel, and if you exceed it switches to gas for backup. RAV4 prime has been my dream car lately…
I have a 10 year old Chevy Volt. 95% of our households driving is on the 38 miles of battery range. Oil changes every 2 years.
No regrets. Polestar 2 MY22 long range AWD. Ride is a lot harsher than in the BMW i4 for instance (family member has one). But overall I wouldn’t want to switch.
The big question is if you can charge at home. Depending on the car, it’s feasible to do so on a normal outlet if you drive ~30 miles or less per day. A 240 volt outlet can be a game changer on top of that though. My setup charges my car 0-100 in about 6 hours (you know, overnight, when I’m not doing anything and electricity is cheapest). But if I were in an apartment and had no access to overnight charging I’d consider other options.
(Chevy Bolt EUV)
So… the work i do requires a truck. I bought a lightning last year. The electric part i loved. Charging at home was awesome. FL sucks on charging stations outside of major cities though and are expensive. In the end i went back to Ram mostly due to how horrible ford’s onboard software is. Everything else about the truck was great. I’ll give manufacturers another 3-5 years to get things figured out and hopefully by then prices will be reasonable and things will work properly.
I haven’t regretted it. Though if you were to do consistent long drives, and only have one car, I might suggest checking out PHEVs.
How do you feel about claims that PHEVs are combining the initial cost of an EV with the repair costs of ICE?
Father in law got one. Loved it until he had some sort of issue and needed to get it repaired. His old Honda Accord he could take down the block to any old mechanic but it was harder with Tesla. I think it soured him on it and he eventually ditched the EC when he moved out of the city
I think mainly the problem there is Tesla. They’re a closed ecosystem.
See how you feel about it after watching this: Aging Wheels/Technology Connections EV Road Trip
We have a Nissan Leaf (30kWh) which has been great. No regrets.
The things you worry about before buying (range, battery life) are absolute non-issues. For optimal battery longevity you don’t want to use a fast charger very often, so just charge it at home which is generally more convenient anyway. You can make exceptions occasionally when you need to.
We use it for city driving, for which the range is more than adequate and we mostly only charge it every few days. We haven’t yet attempted to take it on a proper road trip; so far we just borrow a friend’s hybrid if we need to do that, basically to avoid having to think about charging.
Yeah, I think it’s like 99% of people’s usual range is covered by nearly every electric vehicle. Maybe if you really live in the middle of nowhere then it won’t be ideal for you, but you already know if that’s you or not.
Downsides: Have to go to a gas station to find a squeegee to clean the windows.
Upsides: You have no other reason to go to a gas station.
Sometimes you need to check your tire pressure, too.
The general reduction in scheduled maintenance requirements is really wonderful.
My EV has onboard pressure monitoring. And came with a little electric tire pump.
Too bad if you buy one with a long enough range to completely replace the need to also own an ice vehicle you weigh so much that you have to buy more expensive tires and still need to replace those more often.
Recharge the car when you’re away from home?
Most large gas stations I’ve been to have chargers now.
Good to know. I do more road trips now that I’m not driving an ICE car. Plugshare does list those stations. I have a certain antipathy for ‘petrol’ companies. Something to do with the demise of the human species, to which I’m reasonably concerned about.
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Speaking of doing research, thoughts?
https://www.npr.org/2024/09/23/nx-s1-5074064/ev-gas-cars-environment-skepticism
LoL. Lavender Lad, get on your bike and ride off that anger. It’s not harming anyone apart from yourself.
What about for gas station sushi?
Heh. Now that’s a party.
Good name for a band.
I bought my very own gas station squeegee at a car parts store . Life-changing events.
I better get mine, soon.
Yes, I ended up selling and buying a hybrid. Super happy with the hybrid.
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Basically instant “recharge” speed.
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Longer range.
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More vehicle options.
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Don’t have to worry about heat or cold draining my fuel.
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Can leave the car stationary for long periods of time without the fuel draining.
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More fueling stations.
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More reliable fueling stations (chargers may be broken.)
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Less software bullshit. (Tesla)
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Less possibly breaking updates. (Tesla) No joke. My car’s software literally crashed on the freeway once and I was essentially driving blind because all the screens went blank.
I drive a lot and for long distances. Switching to hybrid made trips shorter by an hour.
And I still got to keep fancy drive assist features. It’s like 80% of autopilot, if not more.
Oh! And big one! Even though an electric car may say something like 500km range! That’s NOT the usable range! You’re not going to be driving the car to 0km. You’re not even supposed to charge to 100% most of the time! So most of the time you’ll charge to 80%, that’s 400km in the battery. But, you probably wanna play it safe, so you’ll want to recharge with 50km to 100km left in the battery. Leaving you with about 300km of usable range.
Then the heat, cold, and time will slowly drain your 300km…
Meanwhile, my hybrid has about 700km of usable range, regardless of time and weather.
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I almost bought a Chinese EV but decided to hold back and not support China because of their support for Russia. Got a 2nd hand ICE Mazda for now which I hope will last me until there’s some non Chinese EV competion in my region or China finally grows some balls and starts doing the right thing.
