If you asked me like 4-8 years ago, I felt kind of neutral about things. Now I don’t feel an ounce bit patriotic or proud enough to even state that I’m an American.
Now, when I see an American flag around, I see it as a symbol of fascism, anti-intelluctialism, neo-nazism, and late-stage capitalism amongst other things. If there’s an American flag flying on a car, I can totally see that person possessing at least one of those qualities.
I suppose it’s good to be self aware and not blindly feel patriotic and ignoring that your country needs improvement.
I don’t know what I’m expecting in the comments here but just thought I would get this off my chest.
What you’re feeling is rationality. Nationalism is an extension of basic primal instinct humans have developed to protect their tribe, but it is only detrimental to modern life.
The greatest lie the Right ever told that the Left bought hook line and sinker was that they were the ones who represented America.
The thing is, while the US has it’s horrible history and present, the people who fought for the ideals we’re supposed to have are also just as much American as any conservative asshole. MLK Jr was American. Frederick Douglass was American. John Brown was American. Mister Rogers was American. Abolitionists. Suffragists. Union fighters. People fighting for fixing the problems, righting the wrongs, holding our country accountable for it’s own ideals, are just as much a part of that flag.
The assholes laid claim to that flag and the people who are aware of the problems, who have legitimate concerns with the bullshit this country has done and continues to do, accidentally let them.
I agree with this with every piece of my heart. I’d like more than anything for American non-maga’s to take back the American flag (and the gadsden for that matter). Let them have their maga and thin blue line, but ceding the American flag to them is essentially admitting that you don’t want to be a part of this country, which only makes maga’s feel more comfortable about labeling you as an “other”. I know, I grew up in a conservative family, and still live in a conservative state. It’s a self-exacerbating problem.
I can sympathize with those that really are done with the country, but I’m not ready to give up yet. We can flip the script. Pride marches should be flooded with American flags. Civil rights too. Force conservatives to come to terms with the fact that they’re no more American than the trans-commie over there waving the big-ass American flag. If we’re so lucky to make it through this and come out the other side a better country, I wouldn’t necessarily be opposed to changing the flag. But right now I believe it makes strategic sense to claim the 50-stars. Fly your other flags with it if you don’t want to be confused for a conservative, then you’re essentially projecting “hey, I’m American too, dumbass!”.
TL;DR: the American left needs stop being so self-concious about what waving an American flag says about them and realize that a.) non-maga’s waving the American flag can be a powerful propaganda tool, and b.) they can take it back.
🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲 NAZI AMERICANS FUCK OFF 🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲
🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸 SHOOT ALL NAZIS ON SIGHT! USA! USA! 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
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So then the question is, what should the flag represent, the people or the ideals? If it’s the ideals, then some real shitheads are trying to steal your flag.
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No, you shouldn’t, because nearly half the country voted against Trump. It wasn’t enough, but it certainly indicates a significant portion of the country opposes him and the ideologies behind him. What we, as Americans, should be ashamed of is our pathetic educational system, which is at the root of this problem.
Both Republicans and Democrats are at the core of this problem. Republicans don’t want any public education at all and Democrats have polluted public education with Far Left propaganda that has fueled conservative rage and helped Far Right people divide the nation. Race and gender issues have eclipsed class issues, which are the real problems of the nation. As much as LGBT and racial groups deserve their particular rights, the real divisions at the heart of America are between the middle- and working-classes and the ultra-rich. Corporations are the prime devil that need to be taken down, not White men. Plenty of White men are suffering at the hands of corporations and they need to be woken up. The most recent election has shown that non-Whites are just as susceptible to Trump’s charms as anyone else. We need to stop focusing on superficial divisors such as race and gender and start focusing on class divisors much more.
Democrats have polluted public education with Far Left propaganda
I’m not familiar with that. Please cite a reputable source.
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As an anti-aurhoritarian I’ve been of the opinion that that we’ve been an authoritarian hell hole for pretty much all of my life. Yes Trump is a fascist but the government is also heavy-handed when Democrats are in power. If you’re encouraged that almost half of the votes went to authoritarian Harris, I’d say you shouldn’t be. She wasn’t a leftist, honestly I think of her as a little bit fascist too, just less ironically puritan.
You know that two things can be bad, but one is worse than the other right?
The flag doesn’t bother me but the pledge to it does. The traitor flags (Confederate battle flag and one bearing a president’s name) do.
Team america, world police
We suck.
And don’t forget, ACAB.
America, FUCK YEAH!
America’s here to ruin your mother fuckin’ daaay…
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The same happens in Spain if you are leftist since the civil war, even before maybe.
Yes and no.
You can can display an American flag and not be a facist. Facists can’t co-opt the US flag.
The flags that look similar to the American flag, but have a blue line or are black/grey are the ones that cringe me up. Those are actual false flags and are anti-patriotic. Right up there with the “rebel” flag.
Maybe get a tiny little flag and put it in your garden.
Totally healthy! I started that when my friends died in Iraq or came back without limbs and sustaining life long trauma. But newbies always welcome 😁
Is it sad that I know your rough age, just based on the fact that you went to THIS country which had an unwarrented war return kids with missing limbs, or they returned in a box…as opposed to if you had said that you went to THIS OTHER country which had an unwarrented war return kids with missing limbs, or they returned in a box.
I know you’re 35-45, and not 70-80. The description is the same, but the boomers had a different country. Vietnam.
I just find it sad that the idea of our country sending an entire generation of kids off to die in a pointless war not only happened…it’s happened for multiple generations! The ONLY difference is that Iraq wasn’t mandated with a draft.
Lol pretty much. My HS US history teacher was a Vietnam vet. He kept a running total of Iraq civilian death and total death toll on the whiteboard. Told us stories from Vietnam of calling in bunk artillery coordinates cause he was tired of seeing dead civs, and how he wish he was a bomber crewmember cause then he wouldn’t have seen it. He updated the Iraq numbers at the start of every class.
Only teacher I’ve seen hit a kid. Kid was being a severe and petty little shit and directly insulted the trauma of servicemen. That teacher wouldn’t have given a fuck if you shit talked the military or the wars but insulting the suffering of his comrades in that specific way sent him. I think everyone kind of just mutually decided it didn’t happen.
Welcome to the club. People from other countries have these thoughts for some time already.
I’m with you. I’m on vacation in a foreign country. There was a performance and part of it was asking the crowd where they were from. I felt no enthusiasm when the performer asked the crowd to cheer if they were from the USA. It felt shameful.
As a fellow ashamed american, I feel you. I’d keep my mouth shut if anyone asked, if not out of shame, then out of (admittedly paranoid) self-preservation.
I hope the rest of your vacation has been/is great!
Thank god one other country with an almost indistinguishable accent exists.
“Boy, those Americans sure are hosers, eh??”
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It really only feels appropriate to see it upside down these days.
I agree that our history has always been fucked up. But there are degrees of fucked up-ness and we’re officially leaving the measurement scale.
It’s fucking over.
I don’t think you’re wrong at all.
Personally, I don’t hate the flag because for me it represents ideals that should be for everyone and that I should be fighting oppression of those against the dream. I have a very Captain America-esque view.
What I cringe and have disgust with are the citizens that want to tear down these just ideals or misrepresent and distort what we should be.
Same, I just feel kind of gross now when I see it. Sad as I still love my country, just not what it’s doing now.
