Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) said the reelection of former President Trump would be the “end of democracy” in an interview released Saturday by The Guardian.
“It will be the end of democracy, functional democracy,” Sanders said in the interview.
The Vermont senator also said in the interview that he thinks that another round of Trump as the president will be a lot more extreme than the first.
“He’s made that clear,” Sanders said. “There’s a lot of personal bitterness, he’s a bitter man, having gone through four indictments, humiliated, he’s going to take it out on his enemies. We’ve got to explain to the American people what that means to them — what the collapse of American democracy will mean to all of us.”
Sanders’s words echo those President Biden made in a recent campaign speech during which he said that Trump’s return to the presidency would risk American democracy. The president highlighted the Jan. 6, 2021 attack on the Capitol in an attempt to cement a point about Trump and other Republicans espousing a kind of extremism that was seen by the world on that day.
He’s right. Of course, this won’t stop “BOTH SIDES” fans, who want fascism in America more than anything else in the world.
They are moving away from “Both Sides” and starting “Biden supports genocide.” It’s just a new way for below average people to think they’re smarter than everyone else.
Biden does support Genocide, in this particular instance. Giving him hell for it and trying to do what people can in order to save all the innocent people getting bombed and shot right now, is fine.
Trump is still infinitely worse. If you think 20,000 dead Gazans is bad, wait until you see what Trump wants to do. Last time around, he fucked up the response to a global crisis that’s currently killed over a million Americans, and that was without even trying; and without any of the vengeful things he’s itching to do this time around if he gets in.
Yes, I think the main issue is (sadly), I don’t think we have an option that actually wants to stop the genocide. It would likely need to be handled by something other than elections, like larger protests.
America and Israel are joined at the hip. Anything less than unconditional military support is not a political position conducive to getting elected, there is intense lobbyism going on to make sure of that. Then there is also the evangelical angle that the jews must control Israel for the rapture to come, so they don’t give two shits about genocide.
Yeah. I saw the stories about protests around the world and felt guilty that I wasn’t in them.
That mother fuckers incompetence is going to kill millions on millions as well as any hope for America’s future. Fucking Nero while Americans burn
The salient point here that so many people are missing is that allowing Trump to be elected because of some misguided ideological purity will absolutely do nothing to protect or liberate the Palestinian people, so why even pretend to care about that, if you aren’t a right wing troll? Allowing far right demagogues to usurp control of western nations will, in fact, cause untold suffering of billions. Palestinians included.
If you are an actual leftist, then it is your duty to consider this moral liability, and soak in the discomfort of the situation with the rest of us. Ideological purity does not cleanse you from this, not matter how much you wish that.
People for whom support for genocide is a dealbreaker exist whether you understand them or not.
If Biden wants their votes, he cannot continue to support genocide.
No amount of insults or accusations will change that.
Those people are going to share some responsibility for the much worse genocide that Trump ushers in, then. They can claim it’s not their fault if that happens, but they’ll be lying.
Preemptively blaming them for the loss that centrist Democrats would prefer to having to abandon support for genocide hasn’t changed the situation:
If Biden wants the votes of people for whom genocide is a dealbreaker, he cannot continue supporting genocide.
Good luck in the hellscape that’s coming, then. You’ll have the comfort of your explanation for why it’s not your fault.
No we won’t. We didn’t want Biden in the first place. The blame lies with every piece of shit who voted for him in the 2020 primaries.
The “Genocide Joe” shit is so obviously right wing astroturfing I legitimately cannot read it without imagining trump sitting at a computer typing with his index fingers.
To be very clear - there are some very big issues with the military support of Israel which should discussed out in the open. But doing the Trump name calling thing isn’t engaging in good faith. It’s obvious trolling.
>The “Genocide Joe” shit is so obviously right wing astroturfing I legitimately cannot read it without imagining trump sitting at a computer typing with his index fingers.
got some evidence for this accusation?
Evidence of me imagining how Trump types?
no, the astroturfing.
Are you asking me how I know that leftists who want Donald Trump to win are fake leftists?
Call us fake leftists if you like but if you need our votes what you label us is irrelevant. We aren’t voting for Joe Biden again. Stop voting for procorporate trash in the primaries.
i’m asking what makes you think leftists who won’t vote for genocide want donald trump to win.
Opposition to genocide is an indicator that someone wants Trump to win?
Of course they don’t. But making wild accusations and insults is a lot easier than reexamining their positions.
“I have serious objections to American foreign policy not being aggressive enough against genocide even when committed by geopolitical allies.”
“Let me take the exact course of action that will put power into the hands that gave the particular genocidal state I’m ostensibly so upset with at this moment the Golan Heights, West Jerusalem, and significant chunks of the West Bank.”
“I am a very smart person!”
Centrist Democrats become very angry at the assertion that Biden should not be supporting genocide.
I’m voting for Biden.
>I’m voting for Biden.
you don’t need to tell him that. tell him your vote depends on fulfilling all your agenda items then vote quietly.
I mean, it doesn’t matter how many times I say it.
Centrist Democrats see criticism of Biden and immediately start thinking of how to dismiss or abuse the critic. The more valid the criticism is, the more vitriolic centrists become. Just watch. At least one of them will ignore that I said I’m voting for Biden and act like I’m not voting or voting for Trump.
If Biden doesn’t want people saying the he supports genocide, he should stop supporting genocide.
When a centrist Democrat breaks out the insults, it’s a surefire indicator they can’t defend their positions on their merits. And since genocide is indefensible, insults are all centrists have. Not that they’ve ever had much else.
It obviously goes without saying, but Biden does not support genocide.
Whoa people are mad that their president is funding a genocide?? :0
Smh they should just stfu and vote. Who cares about foreigners dying
Trump didn’t care about US citizens dying, or did he apologize for fucking up his covid response yet?
Lmao did you think I was suggesting he’s somehow better?
I just find it funny that Americans pretend like their bourgeois “democracy” isn’t just a poorly veiled oligarchy where you get to “choose” between the genocidal zionazi party and the fascist party.
Neither of whom give a fuck about the working class, though one is a bit better at pretending like they do.
One side is clearly better unless you do false equivalence, look at the mortality rate of mothers in states with abortion bans and without etc.
I know this is not as edgy of a take as your both sides cuntery but there is clearly a better and worse choice for the US regardless what kind of zionazi epic words you want to use from your basement setup.
It’s not like Americans don’t know their system is broken, but it’s not like they can fix it one day to the next, they have an election coming up where they have to choose between a shit candidate and a straight up fascist who tried to overthrow their election
Yeah I do agree people should probably still vote for the genocide party, as long as they’re organizing outside the system and building class consciousness to eventually overthrow it.
Just that they shouldn’t pretend like they’re not voting for a genocidal zionazi.
what kind of zionazi epic words
Are “genocide” and “nazi” also “epic words”? It conveys the fact that Biden is a zionist and a nazi quite well, no? Specially when I’ve linked him admitting he is one.
He’s backing Israel because it’s what they’ve always done. It’s a strategic alliance. It’s Nathan yahoo dropping bombs on cities
How is what Americans pretend to do relevant here?
Lmao, did you think I am American?
How is what Americans pretend to do relevant here?
Ah sorry, were we talking about African elections?
did you think I am American?
When did I say you were?
Oh so you just went on some rant about Americans as a reply to me even though it’s not relevant at all, gotcha
Yes, FFS. I am so tired of people falling for that garbage.
It’s just a new way for below average people to think they’re smarter than everyone else.
Now if that ain’t the pot calling the kettle black…
We should not be afraid to speak out against morally unjustifiable support for the mass killing of innocent civillians in our name, and with our tax money. That is the reality of the situation, and it is wrong. It will always be wrong regardless of who is doing the killing.
You thinking you have the more enlightened position simply because you are willing to carte blanche accept this behavior or foreign policy position from the candidate that will be better for the United States doesn’t make you a genius, it makes you self-rigtheous and self-centered. Real innocent people are really dying, and your ability to shrug that off in such a smug, self-satisfied way is truly appalling.
We absolutely should be speaking out against the genocide in Gaza and the US role in it. It is horrific. And I cannot shrug it off in good conscience.
I also intend to take action to prevent things getting worse via Trump being elected again. It is possible to do both.
What I cannot fathom is the same handful of users saying over and over how they cannot vote for Biden in good conscience while refusing to acknowledge that by doing so they are effectively permitting Trump to take office–and that such an outcome will be worse for gaza and worse in many other ways. These are the same folks that somehow don’t see how Republicans getting in power will significantly damage our democracy more than any time in the last half century.
Their inflexibility and refusal to genuinely engage on the topic reminds me an awful lot of the rampant astroturfing on Reddit back when. It gets exhausting seeing the same inane bullshit talking points over and over.
What I cannot fathom is the same handful of users saying over and over how they cannot vote for Biden in good conscience
I can definitely appreciate that, but I’m not one of them.
You thinking you have the more enlightened position simply because you are willing to carte blanche accept this behavior or foreign policy position from the candidate that will be better for the United States doesn’t make you a genius, it makes you self-rigtheous and self-centered. Real innocent people are really dying, and your ability to shrug that off in such a smug, self-satisfied way is truly appalling.
This really isn’t at all what he said, and is an extremely dishonest thing to post.
You complain that your comments fall on deaf ears, but when you accuse people of things that are blatant lies, what do you expect?
This really isn’t at all what he said
It certainly was implied though.
No it wasn’t, not even in the least. It’s absolutely dishonest to pretend that’s what it was.
Go after him for what he actually said instead of making up things to be angry about.
Look, I don’t agree with you. I found what the OP said to be smug and self-satisfying as I said. I also found it to be pointedly critical towards anybody pointing out that Joe Biden has a blind spot in supporting Israel’s unethical campaign against Palestinians.
You want to ignore that element, or you don’t see it that way. That’s your prerogative, but don’t call me dishonest because I’m not being dishonest. There’s a difference between legitimate disagreement and dishonesty.
Look at the text you wrote, and the parts that I bolded.
There is a difference between legitimate disagreement and dishonesty.
Pretending that OP is giving carte blanche to genocide or shrugging that off is an outright lie. Accusing them of anything else based on that lie is also dishonest.
You’ve just said it better than I’ve seen or said.
Thanks, but I expect my comment will mostly fall on deaf ears. I find that to be both sad, and yet entirely expected.
I will vote for Joe Biden because it is the only logical thing to do to save our democracy in the immediate term, and it is in my own self-interest. But I am also fully aware of the false dichotomy we are faced with when it comes to the support for Israel, the killing of innocent people with our tax dollars in the name of a “holy crusade” I don’t believe in, and I refuse to turn a blind eye to that simply because it is psychologically convenient.
Thanks, but I expect my comment will mostly fall on deaf ears.
Maybe it’s enough to say it
Those forkfaces wouldn’t know a good-faith argument if it drugged and molested them at a GOP fundraiser.
Lmao the Guardian source article made me double take on the first paragraph:
That big B looks as if it doesn’t just apply to the first line.
Bernie Sanders sweeps into his state office in Burlington, Vermont, Bitching to get on with our interview. When I try to break the ice by Basking the US senator how he is, he replies gruffly, “Good,”
🅱️itching to get on with the interview,
When I try to break the ice by 🅱️asking the US Senator
🅱️motion
🅱️asking
🅱️ernie
🅿️anders
🅱️ooo
Bernie Sanders sweeps into his state office in Burlington, Vermont, Bitching to get on with our interview. When I try to break the ice by Basking the US senator how he is, he replies gruffly, “Good,”
Such a Bernie response. I love him.
I just want you to know I appreciate that you quoted it correctly
If he is even allowed to run it means The Constitution is just optional.
- for Republicans.
To be clear he’s not even really a Republican, he’s just a rich, racist, white man - and that’s a popular brand
He’s not wrong.
And still, half of America probably is like: “don’t threaten me with good times”.
That already happened in 2010 with Citizens United, and the late Justice John Paul Stevens’ dissent nailed it:
“A democracy cannot function effectively when its constituent members believe laws are being bought and sold.”
Yeah repeal CU
100% correct.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) said the reelection of former President Trump would be the “end of democracy” in an interview released Saturday by The Guardian.
The Vermont senator also said in the interview that he thinks that another round of Trump as the president will be a lot more extreme than the first.
Sanders’s words echo those President Biden made in a recent campaign speech during which he said that Trump’s return to the presidency would risk American democracy.
The president highlighted the Jan. 6, 2021 attack on the Capitol in an attempt to cement a point about Trump and other Republicans espousing a kind of extremism that was seen by the world on that day.
He’s willing to sacrifice democracy to put himself in power,” Biden said in the speech that took place near Valley Forge and on the day before the third anniversary of the Jan. 6 attack.
Biden also said that Trump’s false claims about “the 2020 election never could stand up in court.”
The original article contains 319 words, the summary contains 167 words. Saved 48%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
It survived four years of him and will survive four more.
Your biggest problem is that there is half the country willing to elect him again. Who will they elect next? Trump is not the end point on that particular axis. They were quite prepared to march into the Capitol building. What else are they prepared to do?
Trump is a symptom. Sure, you can stop him running. Hell, he’s a fat old man. Can’t be long until nature takes it’s course. But the country will still be sick.
It survived four years of him and will survive four more.
Because he had no fucking idea what he was doing and no plan. That mistake won’t be made a second time.
It survived four years of him and will survive four more.
If US Democracy is gone, how can it be that there’s (real) elections? There will be a dictator/King at the helm. Barron William Trump is the king-in-waiting at that point.
Democracy is dead then the Constitution is dead and all ‘rights’ revoked.
Bernie for pres.
Except he’s not running, and is too old to run again. So do the next best thing and listen to what he’s fucking saying. This is not a joke.
Voters should have never been put in this position. If we have to depend on Joe Biden and Dems to clutch out the win and save Democracy then you might as well start bracing for the worst. “Not being Trump” is low bar a dangerous way to try to win.
He has done a pretty solid job, and has passed some good legislation. If it weren’t for this whole funding Israel’s horrific war crime thing, I’d have no qualms giving him more time to clean shit up.
deleted by creator
In fairness to the Senator, Trump also loudly and proudly says this all the time.
Actually preventing votes from being counted is the end of democracy.
The requirements to run for president are pretty clearly laid out in the constitution, you must be 35, born in the US, and have not participated in an insurrection against the United States
If someone throws away their vote on someone who is ineligible, that’s their choice
The U.S. was never a democracy to begin with. The Constitution decreed that only rich white males had the vote. Excluding a majority of the population makes it an oligarchy, not a democracy.
Never a democracy
I hear this more and more all over the place. Promoted everywhere seemingly to say it doesn’t matter if everything gets torn down and the US Constitution ripped up— because it’s all BS anyways, right?
The US is a Democratic Republic. Simple As.
This is just in! Genocide Joe is not the other guy!!!
You should know, anyone that says “genocide Joe” unironically isn’t fooling anyone. It’s generally seen as a conservative dogwhistle round these parts.
Genocide Joe is a nickname coined and used by progressives.
Calling it a dogwhistle is generally seen as IDF propganda around these parts.
no progressive use that term. you’re being intentionally disingenuous and it’s obvious to anyone.
any reasonable progressive doesn’t like America’s support of Israel right now but we are all very aware that drump would be worse in all of the ways. so your attitude is pointless and clearly just unnecessary agitation.
I see your username making dumb and controversial comments all the time. high time I block your trolling ass.
Label us whatever you want. I voted for Biden in the 2020 general election and I won’t be voting for him again. The label is irrelevant, all that matters is if you think you need my vote. If you don’t think you need it then ignore me. If you think you need it then start fucking paying attention.
right. so genocide plus fascism is better than just genocide. makes perfect sense.
Stop electing procorporate trash in the primaries. How many times do you need to learn this lesson?
way to dodge the topic
America isn’t even the most democratic democracy in the world tho.
How is this a counter to what he said? The second-most democratic country in the world isn’t the most democratic either, it’d still be a bad thing for it to lose its democracy
America isn’t even the most democratic country in the Americas, but that’s clearly not the point they’re making.
If the title was “…end of world democracy” you’d have a point but given how much fascistic rhetoric and policy has increased around the world since trunpism it’s fair to say many countries are following the US lead here.
Yeah so maybe lets not let the Republicans fick it up even worse.
Curious! Who is?
It’s usually the Nordics and New Zealand topping the rankings each year, depending on which index you ask
Sadly it feels (unsure about factual numbers) that NZ is heading to similar styles as the US in terms of politics.
Two elections ago our slightly right of centre main party used popularist Trump/MAGA style campaigning and got slammed for it.
However the latest govt has bypassed a bunch of good process (using urgency) to just repeel a bunch of stuff the previous govt put in place.
This isn’t necessarily a bad thing. The most possible democracy would require every single government decision requiring a vote by its citizens.
It would be pure chaos and incompetent
I think using process is pretty important and urgency should be used when needed, not just to get a bunch of anti-the last regime policies through.
This is how I understand our governments movements. Everything they have done this with this time could have gone through proper process.
Our leader even said that his politicians were uninterested in hearing what experts in the fields think or what the longer term issues might be from the decisions.
