Summary
A father whose unvaccinated six-year-old daughter became the first U.S. measles death in 10 years remains steadfast in his anti-vaccine beliefs.
The Mennonite man from Seminole, Texas told The Atlantic, “The vaccination has stuff we don’t trust,” maintaining that measles is normal despite its near-eradication through vaccination.
His stance echoes claims by HHS Secretary Robert Kennedy Jr., who initially downplayed the current North American outbreak before changing his position under scrutiny.
Despite his daughter’s death, the father stated, “Everybody has to die.”
Despite his daughter’s death, the father stated, “Everybody has to die.”
Jesus, I can’t imagine being so into cult beliefs that I would have that attitude about my own kids, and actively work to make it happen sooner to boot.
I mean sure, we all will die, but it goes against the most basic biological imperative of all living things to make sure their kids outlive them. Must be some strong Koolaid. Dude needs to fuck off with that Jonestown-isque mindset.
Yeah… You totally can’t trust a vaccine with 97% efficacy and a negligible mortality rate that’s existed for over 80 years versus an extremely infectious virus with a 40% mortality rate and no effective treatment or cure… If only there were extensive scientific studies on these things that were easily and freely accessible to the public! Why do we have to live in such a dark and uninformed time!?
Because conservatives have been gutting education every chance they get throughout history. 🤷♂️
What better way to control the masses than have them all fat, exhausted, stupid, and sick?
Emphasis on “stupid”.
Damn, I’m fat, exhausted, and sick right now because I’ve had bronchitis for the past 2 weeks.
Although I’m not a conservative and I’m arguably not stupid so I have that going for me at least lol
The stupid part is the biggest factor, the rest just wears you down until you’re like “Okay… Just do whatever so I can get out of this.”
Hope you get better soon!
Sorry about the bronchitis. You’re probably sick of sipping warm drinks by now but keep it up, you’re at Mile 21 and ready to make a turn for the better.
because tiny little coffins make great structural support for fascism. imagine how hard it would be to acknowledge your delusional nonsense directly killed your child. would you ever genuinely be capable of doing that? do you know anyone who would be?
buying your unwavering eternal loyalty by killing your kids. it’s great. love fascism.
One small correction. 20-25% require hospitalization, In the third world 1% to 3% mortality rate, in the first world typically 1-in-1000, but note that at least two have died of that initial group that was infected (125?).
Go get vaxxed, dammit.
Everybody has do die
Maybe we make one codfin size S and one XL in this case
This is just so horrifying. Don’t trust? Holy shit, his child is dead!
And what is this “stuff” that he’s talking about? Midi-chlorians?
If they’re injecting people with Midi-chlorians, I volunteer as tribute!
Of course he’s not changing his stance. Doing so would be admitting that his child died as a direct consequence of his own actions. He will forever be anti-vax from now on, even if his life depends on it.
I wonder what the wife thinks.
Hope he told his daughter she had to die to make liberals cry
So basically he’d rather they just die than live with “stuff we don’t trust”. If “everybody has to die”, then why care about what’s in a vaccine in the first place? Extreme cognitive dissonance to support an ideology.
I’m not entirely certain, but depending on which Mennonite community they belong to, they might believe that reaching their desired afterlife requires faithful adherence to their religious practices and commitments.
I think part of the problem is the MMR in the United States is associated with a medical abortion. Certain religious groups won’t take the MMR in account of that. There’s an ethical alternative but it is not commercially available in the US. It would be a good idea to make the alternative strain available here because it would help protect a segment of the population that’s otherwise exposed.
If “everybody has to die”, then why care about what’s in a vaccine in the first place?
Yeah, couldn’t the vaccine side effects be “God’s will” as well?
If everyone “has to die” and “God’s will” why does the pope mobile have bullet proof glass?
The conundrum here is that admitting his stance was wind would take a level of intelligence that would have had him vaccinate his child in the first place.
I know that’s oversimplifying it, but the point still stands.
At this point, I can’t say I would blame him for still refusing to accept it on an emotional level despite all evidence otherwise. As stupid as it is, how might you cope with knowing you are the sole reason that your daughter is dead? That if it weren’t for your arrogance, you would still have a child?
I don’t agree with it, but I understand. I don’t think I could live with myself if I accepted reality if I were in his situation. Shutting down might be his method of coping. It is a sad situation that was easily preventable.
This is why it’s easier to fool someone than to convince them they’d been fooled.
They don’t want to admit they were wrong and taken for a ride. It’s embarrassing, it’s humiliating. They would rather carry their misconceptions to the grave than admit they are incorrect.
It’s a vicious cycle that at least 30% of Americans are going through.
Made even more sad given that, as a child, he likely received the MMR vaccine.
These fools never seem to think about that part.
Maybe, depends if he was born and raised Mennonite then it’s possible he didn’t. But that also means he likely did nothing to comfort his daughter as she died or else he would have caught it too
It’s also possible he was very lucky and had a mild case of measles as a child. That’s often a reason people don’t take a dangerous disease seriously, especially when you add the religious factor. He’s an idiot who killed his child but we don’t know he didn’t care about her or try to comfort her.
Like what?
stuff….
more importantly, measles is trustworthy
Of course he does. He’s desperate to justify his actions, because the alternative is to admit to himself that his choices killed his daughter.
“Stuff in it that we don’t trust.”
Better to be dead than injected with chemicals that might make you autistic? Gay? A liberal? What could possibly be in the vaccines that would be worse than your child no longer existing?
As a parent, I am so angry. How can you look at your child and be more afraid of the lesser outcomes (not that they even exist, but still) and choose death? What a failure of the parents. And shame on every single person in the media that let this bullshit spiral out of control. That poor girl.
What could possibly be in the vaccines that would be worse than your child no longer existing?
The article says the man is a Mennonite, which means he probably believes in an afterlife. In his mind his child still exists and he’ll get to see her again when he passes and spends eternity there.
I pretty firmly believe that afterlife beliefs account for a pretty significant distortion of values in people and helps explain a large number of frankly insane behaviours. Preventing deaths becomes much less important when there’s an eternal paradise waiting for you and the “real” risk is doing something that bars you from going there.
Stuff, you say. I’d wager this fool knows nothing at all about this supposed stuff.
He’s a Mennonite. He’s intentionally ignorant of the modern world and murdered his daughter.
The fuck
He’s Mennonite. They don’t believe in any English medicine/science. If someone dies, it’s God’s will.
Unpopular opinion: I actually respect this. It’s a personal decision not put upon anyone else, has nothing to do with political mis/disinformation, and is entirely consistent with the rest of their beliefs.
I don’t have to agree with them to respect how they choose to live their lives. Especially if they will keep their kids in seclusion if displaying symptoms and wear masks themselves when coming into town.
Maybe they’ll die, but that’s not my call to make, nor can I force them to live my way (nor do I want to).
Except herd immunity is actually important.
These people tend to live apart from society. And I did say:
Especially if they will keep their kids in seclusion if displaying symptoms and wear masks themselves when coming into town.
To address that exact issue.
Perhaps you meant within their own society, but that’s different bc it is consensual. I am not about to force others to share my viewpoints, so long as they likewise respect mine.
I’m not into being supportive of people that want to live in the 1500s for dumb reasons.
1500’s? The measles vaccine was first developed in 1963. The MMR vaccine came out in 1971.
I’m sorry your struggling with my statement. Do you need help figuring out how >before< works?
what do you mean “not put on anyone else”? you think if it’s a personal decision the disease they catch becomes respectful and tries not to infect vulnerable people around them? yes it is put upon everyone else.
and that’s for adults. in this case the decision was put upon the poor little girl who needed them to shield her from the most basic preventable ailments. what other personal decision would you respect? “yeah she ran around with that kitchen knife but we decided not to interfere with god’s will.” wow parents, at least she only hurt herself with that knife, good job on not stabbing other children with it.
Your premise is faulty. The dead child had their personal decision made for them. Its one thing to deny yourself medical care, its another thing entirely to deny a child medical care.
yeah the kid 100% had their dumbass parent’s decision ‘put upon’ them…how this is anything other than child abuse/manslaughter is beyond me - whether they’re in a fringe religious group or not, they are still killing people that didn’t have a real say in that outcome.
Do, ingest or smoke whatever the hell you want. Bring a kid into it and that’s a whole different ballgame. PD tends to get involved, for better or worse
It’s a personal decision not put upon anyone else
Except the dead kid
Yes there is that. It’s a tricky one too bc likely if you were to ask the kid, they would consent to whatever the family says to do. On the other hand, it’s definitely not “informed consent”.
Then again, I choose not to become thought police, so long as the parents themselves give informed consent. The alternative would be to take the child away from their parents, which is also a bad outcome.
Like I said, it’s “tricky”.
Strong disagree. I’m not talking about thought policing, I’m talking about punishing actual decisions that directly lead to the death of a child. People can think and say what they want about vaccines. But when their decision to not get their kid vaccinated directly leads to that kid’s death, that crime leaves the realm of thought.
We as a society don’t hesitate to take children away from parents who beat them, or punish parents who kill them by a malnutrition, and we go rabid over hot cars. These aren’t thought crimes, they are physical actions that physically harm children, and they deserve punishment.
There are many kinds of Mennonites. Most that I know are pretty scientific and well-educated.
Most that I know are pretty scientific and well-educated.
Then why are they mennonites?
I’ll never understand the position. If a deadly disease is God’s will, then so is the vaccine which prevents it.
Mennonites have no problem using blades to cut their hair, wearing glasses when their vision is faulty, or using soap after wiping their ass. Why are they against medicine?
Because they don’t like it, and like all religious groups… if They don’t like it, then its against gods will. And if they like it, then it is gods will.
Which is why god hates vaccines, but loves child rape and wife beating, at least for these Amish-type religious communities. (and probably most of the republican party…)
It’s because you can’t control doctors.
The leaders of their community can control everything, except doctors who follow their own rules.
Rather have children die than anyone who could defy them.
“It’s easier to fool a man than to convince him he’d been fooled.” - Mark Twain
big difference between Mennonites and the Amish I’m pretty sure you’re thinking of
It depends on their sect. The ones that are around where my grandparents used to live did not believe in science or technology. Seemed a lot like the Amish, but definitely were not.
If you can accept the will of God that your child dies without vaccination, you can accept the will of God that your child survived vaccination, even it it caused something unexpected.
A storm descends on a small town, and the downpour soon turns into a flood. As the waters rise, the local preacher kneels in prayer on the church porch, surrounded by water. By and by, one of the townsfolk comes up the street in a canoe.
“Better get in, Preacher. The waters are rising fast."
“No,” says the preacher. “I have faith in the Lord. He will save me.”
Still the waters rise. Now the preacher is up on the balcony, wringing his hands in supplication, when another guy zips up in a motorboat.
“Come on, Preacher. We need to get you out of here. The levee’s gonna break any minute.”
Once again, the preacher is unmoved. “I shall remain. The Lord will see me through.”
After a while the levee breaks, and the flood rushes over the church until only the steeple remains above water. The preacher is up there, clinging to the cross, when a helicopter descends out of the clouds, and a state trooper calls down to him through a megaphone.
“Grab the ladder, Preacher. This is your last chance.”
Once again, the preacher insists the Lord will deliver him.
And, predictably, he drowns.
A pious man, the preacher goes to heaven. After a while he gets an interview with God, and he asks the Almighty, “Lord, I had unwavering faith in you. Why didn’t you deliver me from that flood?”
God shakes his head. “What did you want from me? I sent you two boats and a helicopter.”
Or accept that God sent the scientists that developed the vaccine. The whole “will of God” argument is always so full of holes - logic doesn’t come into it.
Jesus died because of logic! Burn the pineapples – save the cosmos!
There are multiple books in the Bible praising knowledge, intelligence, and wisdom as gifts sent from God.
Which ones? I know people who I’d love to pass this info along to
1 Corinthians 7-12 is a good start. From the ESV.
7 To each is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good. 8 For to one is given through the Spirit the utterance of wisdom, and to another the utterance of knowledge according to the same Spirit, 9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit, 10 to another the working of miracles, to another prophecy, to another the ability to distinguish between spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, to another the interpretation of tongues. 11 All these are empowered by one and the same Spirit, who apportions to each one individually as he wills.
Proverbs I’m sure as I read recently. Others I need to read again. Ecclesiastes likely also has something like this.
Job, Psalms, and Song of Songs are also part of the “Wisdom” block, but their focus is different.
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